Arms/Shoulders isolation day

[pathofwarriors]

Im currently on a GVS style Torso/Arms/Legs 6 day split, focusing on the compounds, progressing, and sticking to a handful of Isolation movements. My arms/shoulders day is as follows:

Arms day 1:

Rope curls 4x12-15
Pushdowns 3x10-12
Barbell curls 3x8-12
B/O tricep cable OHE 4x10-12
Upright Rows 4x10-12
DB lateral raises 3x12-15
Incline curls 3x8-10
Forearm curls/extensions 3x10-15 (each)

Arms day 2:

Hammer curls 4x10-20
JM press 4x8-12
Cable Spider curls 3x10-15
Upright Tricep cable OHE 4x8-12
Upright Rows/DB lateral raises superset 4x10-12
Cable one arm preacher curls 3x10-12
Cable cuffed lateral raises 3x12-15
Forearm curls/extensions 3x10-15 (each)

Should I rearrange anything, cut out?

 

[leena2016]

@pathofwarriors If you're doing someone else's program, just do the program. If you're doing it & your body is telling you certain things that suggest changes should be made, then make those changes. But don't get someone else's routine & ask if you should change it. If you know what volume works for you then just do it.

 

[pathofwarriors]

@leena2016 I only added the JM press to GVSs split, thats it, I dont feel i can do CGBP on arm day like he does.

 

[leena2016]

@pathofwarriors If you feel this way because you've done similar movements with similar volume and frequency in the past and are taking the feedback of your body into account, then that's all the affirmation you need

 

[helen2002]

@pathofwarriors So that's 10 sets of Biceps, that's a lot and are probably in junk volume territory if you're training with intensity. I'd drop them all to 2 sets.

4 - 6 sets in the workout should maximise any stimulus without the crazy fatigue.

You seem to be trying to do every variation possible for all 3 muscle groups every week. You have 6 different types of curls a week. This isn't necessarily bad but I think you'd progress quicker if you focused on progressing a smaller number of variations and swapping them down the line when they stall.

 

[pathofwarriors]

@helen2002 So should I just do 2 different excersises for each muscle with 3 sets max? Or can I do 3 different with 3/3/2 sets each? Theres only two triceps excersises on day 2, not that much variation tbh. Biceps maybe i am doing too much of too many. How about shoulder volume for both days, is that also too much?

 

[helen2002]

@pathofwarriors It's largely preference. If it was me and you like variety I would do 2 sets of each of the 3 movements but just repeat the same exact workout later in the week instead of alternating it again. Ie. Workout A then Workout A again and only swap out movements in a couple of months when they stall. 3 different movements is more than enough.

Preacher Curl > Normal Curl > Hammer for Biceps in that order of effectiveness.

Triceps you only really need a good Pushdown and an overhead + a repeat of what's lagging.

 

[pathofwarriors]

@helen2002 I understand your method, it makes alot of sense. On a last note, the only thing i technically swap is the equipment on curls or Lateral raises. Same movement, different tools, i like both freeweights and cables equally, which is why i swap them.

 

[lamberto]

@pathofwarriors Could do PPL and hit the antagonistic arm muscles on pull or push etc -- 6/week means arms are being hit 4/6 days per week.

Pulling exercises + Triceps
Legs
Pushing exercises + Biceps
Rest
Repeat PLP

 

[pathofwarriors]

@lamberto Was almost going to switch back to exactly this, but ive been on this split for 5 months now, im too invested at this point. Also, the "arms day" feels like a break from heavy compounds by programing it in between Upper/Lower days, it just makes sense.

 

[junior59]

@pathofwarriors Too many different exercises. Pick a few decent ones and call it a day.

Some kind of supinated grip curl, some kind of neutral grip curl for brachialis (hammer curl)

Some kind of tricep extension with arms below your head. Some kind of extension with arms above your head.

Forearms if you want

Edit: I prefer shoulders before arms. More likely for triceps work to interfere with shoulder work than vice versa

 

[pathofwarriors]

@junior59 Well technically I chose each excersise with care, I understand the concept/function of these muscle groups. GVS warms up with hammer curls then moves on to overhead extension work, these two I find very important for growth, and to really focus on. I only use cables for triceps with the exception of the JM press which has started showing progress, my elbow is getting meatier. I know shoulders are the larger group here, but on Torso day I cover all the bases with the rear and front, with pushes and rows. I should maybe title this "arms and side delts day"?? For me triceps are my main focus here, side delts second, biceps last.

 

[junior59]

@pathofwarriors Gotcha ya if your focus is just side delts for that day that seems fine. I overindexed a bit because I do a shoulder+arm day as well but it's a full shoulder routine for me (with pressing etc). Ordering shoulders later in the workout seems fine to me then.

As far as biceps/triceps selection imo still too many different variations. My own preference is to keep it simple for a given meso and instead add some variation in the form of different rep ranges, adding some intensity techniques like drop sets, cluster sets, etc. I'd vary them over a longer timeframe like months rather than do all of them across 2 sessions.

Just my own 2 cents

 

[pathofwarriors]

@junior59 Do you bench the day before? If yes, hows your performance on the OHP the next day? Really tempted to cut down bicep/tricep volume in favor of an OHP.

 

[junior59]

@pathofwarriors Ya fair question, kind of complicated answer.

My current split is pretty heavily autoregulated based on how I feel. Loosely follows Arnold split.

I have 3 days
D1 - chest+ back (including bench)
D2- shoulders + arms (seated ohp is my main shoulder compound)
D3 - legs

I aim to run D1 and D2 twice, D3 once per week.

Usually D1 and D2 is back to back if shoulders and overall fatigue level feel okay after D1, but if I feel worn I take a rest day in between. I'll drop the second D2 if I'm particularly busy or tired.

Been running this for ~ 3 months and so far have seen phenomenal muscle gain in arms and shoulders (which have always been lagging part for me), noting my calories are pretty high too rn.

I can type out my full split later if you're interested or lmk if you have any questions.
But in short, for the most part back to back bench and ohp (across 2 days) has mostly been fine for me

 

[arianwen]

@pathofwarriors Id go shoulders first, like they dont build insane fatigue and so you do them being fresh and at the same time your arms workout wont suffer much, i feel like its a win-win situation.

 

[miles44]

@pathofwarriors I do BB curls before rope curls personally, the same for cable OHE and pushdown. other than that it looks good. also quite a bit of volume, 10 sets for just biceps in 1 day? Thats 20/week, not counting back lifts. I would do near half that much volume. Maybe 12-14 sets / week.

 

[kukla]

@pathofwarriors I agree that if you are doing someone's program, just go ahead and do it, at least the first time.

TBH, little things don't make that much of a difference in ones program, but if you start cutting things out etc, then you aren't doing that program, and if it doesn't work, you (really, one) might blame "GVS" saying it doesn't work. It also keeps you from being able to look back and make an objective analysis. Sometimes things work over time that may not seem like they will initially.

Edit: you also have to keep the advice you get in context. I see HIT enthusiasts telling you are doing too much. Well, that's not really an objective analysis. I'm not saying they are wrong necessarily, just that there is context to the comment.

 

[pathofwarriors]

@kukla Ive agreed with everyone giving feedback on this post for the most part, i am going to switch back to 2 sets per workout just like GVSs Ravage also indicated. This program is pretty much centered in HIT, going beyond faliure, and im handling it well tbh. The problem is GVS is at commercial gyms in every session, and I unfortunately dont hit the gym where there smith machines, machine presses etc., so I only improvised based on equipment, thats all. My home gym consists of barbells, dumbells and a cable station, thats all you need imo, but I do go atleast twice a week to a gym for cardio and legs. Also, theres nothing wrong with taking inspiration from someone elses program and committing to it fully as long as you feel good and progress, ive been doing this for 5 months now and im liking it, this post was for feedback only, not criticisms of anyone or their program.

 

[kukla]

@pathofwarriors I didn't mean to imply you would blame the program, That is why I put (really, one). My context is coaching people and also giving solicited but non paid advice (not on forums, but friends etc) . In fact, for whatever reason, I currently see it with Ketogenic diets the most. People want "just the hows" but don't pay attention to the "whys". They don't do the diets right, then they will say "I did keto and it doesn't work". This is opposed to "did it right, and it didn't work".

You had specific set/rep amounts, so I answered in that context. Whether it was "okay".

If someone has a firm bias, they will not give an objective answer. It doesn't mean they are wrong, it just means that they aren't judging objectively. If you asked ME when I was in my Arthur Jones is God HIT phase, ANY program that had more than 1-2 sets/exercise, I would have said it was "wrong". And been quite convincing.

I get what you are saying about commercial gyms. There are often limitations to doing different programs given how many days you have to workout, what your gym has, what TIME you can get to the gym etc.

It is helpful to have that information as part of the question if available.

For example, if you say "I'm doing JoeBlows 5 x 5 that requires Squats do I have to do them?" I would likely say "do it as prescribed"

If you said "I'm doing JoeBlows 5 x 5 and I often can't get to the squat rack at 6pm, do I have to do them" I would give a different answer.