4 day split? (25 y/o)

[godsmusician]

I’d love some assistance or wisdom from the OG’s
Basically I’ve been working out for 4 years. I was doing your typical bro split for the first three years and made some pretty good gainz I think. A year ago I started this job with a 4 on 4 off schedule, 12 hour shifts. So I’ve basically been working out 4 days then having 4 off as the 12 hours kick my ass. I do a leg day my first day off, chest/bi/abs the 2nd, tri’s and shoulders the 3rd, then bi’s and back the final day off, and I do calves anytime I hit the gym (though they refuse to grow) my split probably sucks but I don’t know what else to do.. In the last year of working out I have pretty much stayed the exact same which is depressing. I’d like to get up to 200 pounds without getting to fat. The last year I’ve pretty much hovered around 180. My diets not terrible, no soda, lots of protein though I don’t track my macros. I guess I’m just wondering if you guy have any optimal training routines or schedules that would benefit me more. I could hit the gym on my work days aswell to ensure I’m hitting each muscle twice a week it will just suck. I am not a body builder nor do I want to be, I just want to look jacked.

 

[hellofriends]

@godsmusician The split is rarely the problem. The reason you are not progressing is probably a mix of these:

a) Not eating enough calories

b) Not recovering enough

c) Not progressing with your lifts and not going close to muscle failure. You can't expect to grow muscles if you still lift the same weights you did last year. The reason most people fail to progress with their lifts are: diet / technique / too low of intensity

I personally like to use the Top Set / Backoff Set method to progress with my lifts. You can google how that works and give it a try

 

[don720]

@godsmusician You can grow your muscles on 1x per week frequency. It's just that 2-3x is more preferable as you can spread out effective volume on more days and spam the stimulus-recovery-adaptation cycle on the muscle to grow it faster.

On your question on how to make progress: Make sure you cover your bases first.

1. Eat enough. No need for dirty bulking and excessive fat gain, a 200-300+ caloric surplus will suffice.
2. Recover well.
3. Hit your muscles with close proximity to failure, put effort into every set. Don't half-ass your training, especially when you're training your muscles once per week.
4. Do enough volume. This is variable and changing depending on your muscle work capacity and which muscles you'd like to focus more on. 8-12 sets per muscle group is a good number to start with and adjust up or down to your body's need and progression.
5. Don't force progression. Make sure your technique is good enough, and add weight only when it doesn't compromise your technique/ROM. Look up "Double progression", it's a simple and tried method.
6. Log your training. This is optional, but keeping a log makes you more accountable and reminds where have you been and where are you heading.

Regarding your physique goal at 200lb. I can't comment on that because I don't know your training age and development stage exactly. How lean do you want to be at 200lb? Don't focus too much on numbers and keep your goal physique on your mind. If you look better lean at 170lb for example than bloated at 200lb why the number matters?

 

[catholic500]

@don720

Eat enough. No need for dirty bulking and excessive fat gain, a 200-300+ caloric surplus will suffice.

Every single suggestion is fantastic advice that I also follow. Just wanted to highlight the importance of this one - too many people think you have to be in a huge surplus so eat stupid amounts of food at like +500-1000 surplus. All that results in is fat gain - Jeff Nippard cites a study in one of his videos that confirms it's an absolute waste.

I eat at a minor caloric surplus and I've been gaining weight very slowly (like 2 lbs in a month) with basically no fat gain (none that I can see anyway), all the while making noticeable strength gains. I think creating a meal plan that covers your basic protein/fat needs and then eating intuitively on top of that is the way to go.

 

[don720]

@catholic500 My brother in iron, when I gained 30lb in 6 months in my second bulk thinking I was maximizing gains, I gained a little yes, but at what cost? an 8 months of excruciatingly painful cut. And the funny thing is, even when I was cutting I was slowly progressing, right there and then, I realized dirty bulking is a meme and a scam.

 

[htb33rod]

@don720 Amen. I’ve spent a year cutting from getting too fat. It’s a huge pain in the ass.

You tend to always have more fat than you think if you’re bear mode.

 

[lamporful]

@godsmusician Upper Lower 2x a week is my personal favorite. Perfect frequency and lots of time for recovery.

 

[londonn]

@lamporful That’s a great programs for a 4 day split.

 

[lamporful]

@londonn A lot of people forget that recovery days is where the growth happens. That’s why I love that split so much. The best natural bodybuilders hit each muscle twice a week within 4 days and have amazing results.

 

[londonn]

@lamporful I’m currently doing full body 2x/weeks. This gives me plenty of time for martial arts like mma and bjj.

 

[lamporful]

@londonn That’s all you really need. I used to do martial arts and had great results doing full body 2x a week. Lean muscle, strength, recovery, etc were all on point. Natural lifters need to realize that frequency is more important than volume. 2-3 sets per exercise has always been the sweet spot.

 

[godsmusician]

@lamporful I’m gonna start doing this split

 

[htb33rod]

@lamporful Bingo. I always blow up on upper lower. It leaves more time for recovery of the joints and CNS in comparison to PPL. While still getting nice frequency and adequate volume.

Key is to train with intensity since you’re doing less.

 

[lamporful]

@htb33rod Even on a cut. It’s amazing! I always get fried on PPL even when my nutrition is on point, sleep,etc. I have the most muscular density when doing UL . I’m using it for my prep with added isolation

 

[pif15]

@godsmusician I would say it’s less your split and more
You calories if you wanna get up to 200 you need a surplus and only way to know
You’re in one is to track for a abit, ask you could do upper lower split giving you the 2x per week frequency you’re after

 

[needheaven]

@godsmusician There are plenty of splits you can do but as others said the split isn't the problem.

 

[mcolley10]

@godsmusician Eat enough to grow
Train with higher proximity to failure
Reduce volume

What does your current set and rep scheme look like and what is your proximity to failure

Also, brother, you are trying to gain 20lbs of lean tissue? That’s a 5 year journey minimum as you are not a noob and probably far passed your newbie gains stage. Getting to 200is easy getting there with no fat is not.

How fat are you at 180?

 

[godsmusician]

@mcolley10 Not sure how fat I am but here’s some images for reference idk

 

[godsmusician]

@mcolley10 Yeah that link won’t work I have no idea how to share pictures on here lol

 

[mm1992]

@godsmusician Not many splits will work with 4 on 4 off. I’d say a legs, chest/shoulders, back, arms split would work well for focusing on upper body and a legs, push,pull,legs for focusing on legs. You could also do legs,chest/back,shoulders/arms,legs if you like having the arm day but still want to focus on legs.