Been doing the RR for 4-5 years, looking for feedback on a custom routine

[narrowisthepath]

I'm about to graduate which will free up a lot of time, so I figured I'd get back into working out. I have a couple of goals in mind.

1. Start doing some cool stuff. So far I've just trained for fitness, but I do want to do cool stuff like handstands, front levers, etc.
2. Getting functional strength in terms of lifting irregularly shaped heavy stuff. I struggled with lugging around ~100lbs of scuba gear a couple years ago when getting my scuba license, and I would like to train for that.

Stats


Age
24

Sex
M

Height
5'6.5"

Weight
~170lbs (was ~175 at my peak)

Current Routine
RR

Experience
4-5 Years (But only consistently for years 1, 3, and 4)

Progression Peaks


Pull-ups
3x7 Pull ups + ~10lbs

Squat
3x8 One legged squat

Dip
3x8 Dips

Hinge
3x8 Single Leg Hamstring Slide

Row
3x5 Tuck Front Lever Pulls

Pushups
3x8 RTO Pushups

Core
Minute plank, didn't really do much of the others

Here's my proposed routine:

#Upper

Category Exercise Progression
Warmup
Simple 6 w/o Static stuff
Skill
Handstand

Vertical Pull
Pull up

Vertical Push
Overhead Press (dumbell)

Horizontal Push
Push Up

Horizontal Pull
Tuck Front Lever Pulls

Elbow Flexion
Bicep Curl (dumbell)

Elbow Extension
Overhead Triceps Extension (dumbell)

#Lower/Core

Category Exercise Progression
Warmup
Agile 8 w/o Static stuff
Skill
L Sit

Quad Dominant
Weighted Lunges (dumbell)

Hamstring Dominant
Nordic Curl

Core Anti-Extension
Hanging Leg Raises

Core Anti-Rotation
Copenhagen Plank

Core Extension
Reverse Hyperextension

#Off/Rest
r/fitness beginner stretch routine
Jump rope

For training frequency, I'm planning to do something like Upper, Lower, Rest, Upper, Lower, Rest, Rest. I haven't gotten to the exercise order yet nor the number of reps and sets. I haven't been particularly active this past year so I'll need to experiment a bit.

My questions are as such:

1. Are there any muscle groups that I'm not targeting enough?
   
2. Are there any muscles that I may be overworking?
   
3. Are there exercises I should add to help me with goal #2?

 

[leoriofarel]

@narrowisthepath It looks like you have an issue with your training unrelated to your programming. I’d have expected better results in some of these categories even with inconsistent training.

Given your goals I would personally steer towards straight strength training, combined with some time spent on skills.

Something like 5/3/1 (look up 5/3/1 boring but big as an example) with bodyweight exercises as accessory movements, and some hand balancing at the start of your sessions would move you towards your goals.

 

[legatichristi]

@leoriofarel Yeah I'm with you... 5 years of training, no matter how inconsistent, doesn't peak at bodyweight dips, 10 lbs pullups and hamstring slides, you should be far beyond that.

 

[valujira]

@legatichristi It's strange because, as someone who's not world class but I've gotten the basics mastered, there's a Bigg diff between 3x8 dips and 3x8 RTO pushups assuming that's full RTO

I'm not even sure how one can do 3x8 RTO pushups and only 8 bodyweight dips, plus 3x8 RTO pushups vs 3x7 pullups with 10 lbs is also a massive strength diff

 

[narrowisthepath]

@legatichristi In your opinion, where should I be at? There were some progressions where I ran out of more difficult variations (or didn't have the equipment) and didn't bother to add more reps after hitting 3x8 (hamstring slides, squats, pushups). But on the other hand, I particularly felt slow progress in my pullups, dips, and rows.

 

[valujira]

@narrowisthepath Pullups progress slow for everyone, that's fine!

I started obese, at 0 pullups, and I have bad leverages (very long arms). In 2-3 years I could do 15-20 full range of motion pullups for working sets..and I ran bad programs for a while too, it's only later that I started following s routine

I would expect someone leaner or shorter arms to progress even faster, this is for a young healthy male btw

 

[legatichristi]

@narrowisthepath So here are the overcoming gravity progression charts. Anything "beginner" is achievable within a year of good training, intermediate stuff is mostly doable in ~5 years or quicker with specialized training, advanced stuff is lifetime goals and elite stuff is pretty much athletes only.

Obvs you trained off and on, but a year of consistent training should get you to pulling over a plate (45 lbs), and dipping a bit more than that.

Tbh I think you have a case of fuckarounditis - how bad that case may be is up to you, but I expect you to soar once you graduate and get consistent with it for the next year. (congrats on graduating btw!). Once I graduated it did end up being a lot easier to be consistent and I think you'll be in a good spot ~6 months from now, but you should probably assess your Level of Effort and Consistency over the last 5 years to identify weaknesses.

 

[narrowisthepath]

@legatichristi

So here are the overcoming gravity progression charts. Anything "beginner" is achievable within a year of good training, intermediate stuff is mostly doable in ~5 years or quicker

Oooh that's a good resource. To clarify, to have accomplished a level, would I have to be able to do the exercise once or for reps/sets?

Tbh I think you have a case of fuckarounditis - how bad that case may be is up to you

I can definitely relate with a couple of the symptom is the article. I have one question about 7, or "You’re looking a bit too happy in there. If you’re not grimacing, grunting, or experiencing some sort of discomfort, you’re not training hard enough. One good set where you have to fight for the reps is better than a week of half-ass sets."

How much "discomfort" am I supposed to be pushing through? I was under the impression that I should stop as soon as I couldn't maintain good form/full ROM because that means I'm close to failure.

congrats on graduating btw!

Thanks!

 

[legatichristi]

@narrowisthepath

To clarify, to have accomplished a level, would I have to be able to do the exercise once or for reps/sets?

Honestly this more of a "guidepost" spreadsheet than a "goalpost" one so up to you. I would say 1 Rep max for anything with reps or 5 second hold for static stuff

How much "discomfort" am I supposed to be pushing through?

Look, it's kinda on the edge of where workout literature breaks down. Like, sleeping 8+ hours a night is better for your gains than not... but I don't know a single person that actually got strong without sacrificing some sleep. In theory, every rep should be good form, but if you never have sets that end in you shaking and sweating and not sure if you're gonna make it on the last rep, you're not doing it hard enough. Not saying every set or even every workout has to be this way, but you should have reps that are a grind to get out. I think a good rule of thumb is to look at your training program and how rested you feel after the prescribed rest times - when I was doing the RR with 90 second rests, I was sweating and tired enough that a few sets in, 90 seconds didn't feel like enough rest. Or, another rule of thumb - a good workout requires a shower and change of clothes afterwards, not some deodorant.

 

[narrowisthepath]

@leoriofarel So I looked up 5/3/1 (and 5/3/1 boring but big) and it seems that it requires access to a barbell (and a bench) seeing as it focuses on the big three.

The equipment I have consist of a power rack, gym rings, and adjustable dumbells up to 50lbs (a new addition). Would I be able to substitute the barbell for dumbells?

 

[leoriofarel]

@narrowisthepath In your situation I would try and get access to a barbell. You can definitely make progress without one, but it simplifies things a lot.

You could do 5/3/1 with dumbbells, but you’ll fairly quickly outgrow 50lbs for staple exercises like bench and even goblet squats.

The reason I mentioned 5/3/1 is because it writes out your progression for you, and ensures that you are working hard enough.

Another way you could organise training is to do the Russian fighter method for pull ups (maybe dips or ring push ups too) and fill in the rest with dumbbell work.

For upper body, I wouldn’t do much more than this, as you don’t want to miss out on progression by being too tired. Maybe on the last day do some extra work as you have a couple of days to recover.

For legs, I would focus on doing Bulgarian split squats, and single leg RDLs. The dumbbells you have will be enough for a while. Use straps. 3 sets each a couple of times per week will do. Work hard enough that it hurts. It needs to be uncomfortable to get results. Work towards a Cossack squat too if you can.

Core is not so challenging. Same as above, a few sets of for each muscle a couple of times per week. For abs a dragon flag regression on one day, and some sort of leg raise or sit up on the other. Side planks on one day and dumbbell side bends on the other (use straps).

You should be able to work all of that together into a routine. I think that your issue was likely to be effort given to training. Make sure that for your next 8 weeks or so, you write down everything you do and focus on beating any personal best you can.

 

[narrowisthepath]

@leoriofarel Dang, thanks for the super in-depth guidance! Combined with the feedback from everyone else, it really helps paint a more complete picture.

 

[valujira]

@narrowisthepath First of all, I'm not a believer that a specific type of split is objectively superior. By all means, if you prefer an upper lower compared to a full body, go ahead and do it, ultimately it doesn't make a big difference and the program you enjoy the most will bring the most consistency.

I do believe that, given your equipment and exercise selection, the upper lower is not the best split since your leg exercises are fairly low fatigue and won't be too hard to fit into a full body session.

Regarding your progress, I would run a basic strength/ hypertrophy program until you've reached the intermediate stage

I would say 15-20 full range of motion pullups, 40-50+ full range of motion pushups, 30+ full range of motion dips

Alternatively, being able to do a weighted pull-up for 40kg with 3-5 reps and the same for weighted dips for 8-12 reps would be close to equivalent

Ensure that you're in a caloric surplus so you can gain muscle

 

[narrowisthepath]

@valujira Okay, so it seems the consensus is that my overall strength is much too low for my experience, and that I should stick with basic routines an work on strength.

I'm assuming the Fierce 5 routine found from the r/fitness wiki would suit this purpose.

Would I still be good to start doing skill work (for handstands and L sits) before workouts or should that wait till I've reached the intermediate stage?