Bulking (and Cutting) for the first time!

[caspernl]

Background: I'm 35 years old, 172cm (~5'8") and am currently at about 67kg (~148lbs), eating between 2800-3000 (40% protein, 35% carb, 25% fat) calories a day.

Context:

• I used to be pretty scrawny (skinny-fat in fact) before I started on my fitness journey
• I have been hitting the gym for a few years but only took it seriously in the second half of 2023 by going 4-5 times a week religiously and trying to push myself to failure.
• I have however noticed that I plateaued for a few months now.
• My goal is to achieve a lean physique (image here for reference).
• I used to maintain a weight of 57-60kg (125-132lbs) but for some reason the belly fat just stuck with me which was the main reason why I decided to start bulking
• I realized sleep is really critical and something that I unfortunately do not have the luxury of. I have been diagnosed with Upper Airway Resistance Syndrome - which basically interrupts my sleep where I wake up multiple times through the night. I am in the midst of getting double jaw surgery to fix this.
• Bulking hasn't been easy. As someone who has been skinny all his life, I lose weight so much more easily than gaining weight and it always bums me to see my weight fall back a few kilos/pounds after eating what I thought was a crazy day of meals. But, slow and easy - after some months of really forcing myself to eat, I've seen my weight increased steadily.
• I learn a lot from fitness content online but because it's so saturated and often times, it's common to hear a person say one thing, and another person contradict - so there's been a lot of trial-and-error on my end. I can only say there's no one-size-fit-all solution and until today, it's still a learning process and I still consider myself fairly new to the fitness world - hence why I started this thread to see if I can get some advice to achieving my goal.
• Leg days were non-existent for me until this year when I started doing it at least once a week.

Gym Routine:

I basically do 2 sets per exercise to failure. Below's my routine:

• 1x Leg Day
  
• Leg Press
  
• Leg Extension
  
• Seated Leg Curl
  
• Calf Raise
• 2x Push Day
  
• Chest Press Machine (image for ref)
  
• Pec Deck / Chest Fly Machine
  
• Incline Chest Press Machine
  
• Shoulder Press Machine [Neutral Grip]
  
• Cable Lateral Raise (ref for form) -- I switch to DB if machine is occupied
  
• Rear Delt Machine
  
• Tricep Press Machine
• 2x Pull Day
  
• Lat Pulldown (Medium Grip Neutral)
  
• Cable Pulldown (Straight Bar)
  
• Chest Supported T-Bar Row
  
• Single-Arm Seated Cable Row (D-Handle)
  
• Bicep Curl Machine (image for ref)
  
• Single-Arm Preacher Dumbbell Curl
  
• Single-Arm Preacher Hammer Curl

BURNING QUESTIONS:

I know that I'm going to lose some muscle mass after my jaw surgery but I would really like to make some progress towards achieving my goal. There are some questions that I still do not know the answers to or have doubts so any advice would be greatly appreciated!

• BULKING/CUTTING TO ACHIEVE GOAL PHYSIQUE (image for ref): Given my height, what would be the rough weight and body fat I should be looking at when it comes to achieving a lean physique like that? I have bulked a substantial 7-10kg over the course of several months and this is my current body. I have seen people suggesting to bulk until you feel disgusted looking at yourself, which I already am (lol) but being new to the bulking-cutting cycle, I'm quite at a loss at what to do. Do I continue to bulk? When do I stop and start to cut? And when do I know when to stop cutting too?
• EFFECTS OF CUTTING: I think I've seen mixed responses on this but do you lose strength while cutting? Should you be maintaining your weights at the gym while cutting or is it common to decrease the weights? I had never understood this but if your strength really does shrink, then are you not technically in a loop of cutting and bulking without seeing any improvement since you shrink in strength while cutting and gain while bulking? I know I'm definitely wrong somewhere here!
• OPINION ON ROUTINE: Any general critique or opinions to improving my routine, I would also be grateful. In trying to achieve my goal physique, one thing I noticed I lack sorely is a V-taper back to give that 'illusion' of a lean physique. However, I've struggled to grow my lats for awhile now or they are not as prominent as I would like them to be. You will also notice most of my exercises are machine-based which I'm more inclined towards because of the stability.
• PROGRESS IN GYM: As I've plateaued awhile now, I've always wondered how long everyone takes before they move on to the next weight (i.e. increase by 5lbs) although I know this is quite subjective. While I had obvious, noticeable growth at the start, I used to think this would be the case where I could continue to increase the weights at the same rate but this has proven to be untrue with the plateau. I am now trying out a method where I will aim to hit all my sets within the 8-10 rep range. If I can do 10, I move up to the next weight. If I can do 8-9, I maintain, and any lesser, I move down to the next weight.

I'm sure I'll have more questions in time to come but grateful for any advice for now!!

 

[dawn16]

@caspernl You can lose a bit of strength on the top end of some exercises. Like after 6 weeks of cutting and around 10lbs or so lost you might lose like 1-2 reps on some exercises but find that on some other ones its about the same or more than what it was when you started cutting. Hardly anyone stays in a perfect cut or deficit day after day.

If you really want to maintain your strength in your exercises I would keep the reps about the same. I’ve found if I keep an exercise at 6 reps or 8 reps on a cut not only do I progress a bit through the cut I maintain my strength about where I left off.

If however I start doing higher reps in the middle or near the end I will come back to my rep plan for a bulk or maintenance to find that my 6 rep range went down like 1-2 reps didn’t make progress. Sometimes though it might be more of a mind muscle thing because I went higher reps for 3 weeks or so.

If your having a hard time eating enough food to bulk pick up a mass gainer (800-1300 cal) or a weight gainer (500-700 cal) both have around 50g of protein and its cheaper and healthier than packing on more foods.

Carbs are usually high in calories if you have met your protein goal consider stuff like high calorie fruits such as an avocado (250-320 cal) or banana (80-150 cal) or high calorie carbs like quaker old style oats (300cal a cup) with some sweetener mixed in.

A home made pb and honey sandwhich even with thomas light multi grain muffins can easily hit 600 calories with just 3tbsp of pb and 2-3 tbsp of honey.

If your on a bulk or around maintenance and hitting plateaus its usually your diet and programming. Technique can play a decent role. At the end of the day its usually diet and programming. If your bulking and hitting the right protein goals and your hitting plateaus its usually your programming.

Some exercises like bicep curls and tricep exercises are just better in the higher rep range. Once you get to curling like 35-40 lbs the 8 rep range will just be slop on something like a incline curl. Maybe not standing. Once you can move weight like that or a whole cable stack you got to hit 12 reps or even 15 or even 30 in some cases and use ropes and one handed exercises. I just hit that point myself and had to figure that all out.

Other exercises like bench and incline bench or a row is usually gonna benefit you more in the 6-10 range probably better in the 6-8 and companied with some lighter higher rep work with good technique like dumbbell bench for 10-12 reps and cable chest flys for 12-15. It’ll light your chest up. Especially a real seated cable fly.

Heres a book on bulking and cutting.
Basically you dont want to gain or lose more than 10 percent of your weight in one block or cycle. You dont want to cut longer than around than 6-8 weeks in one go and don’t bulk more than 12-16 weeks straight and you dont want to dirty bulk or gain more than 10% if your weight in one go. Take a maintenance volume and maintenance calories after a bulk. If I remember right.

Heres a link to the book and some internet articles -

https://www.amazon.com/Renaissance-Diet-2-0-Scientific-Performance/dp/1782551905

Free T nation complete guide to bulk and cut

https://forums.t-nation.com/t/the-complete-guide-to-bulking-and-cutting/283947

You can also do mini cuts. Im doing a long cut now because I did a 4 month bulk. Now I run a 6 week bulk and assess my weight gain, do a mini cut if I need it or maintence weeks then a cut, then another 6 week bulk. If I dont need a cut I’ll bulk 12 weeks straight with a deload in the middle.

Your routine is looking pretty good. Nice job!!

 

[caspernl]

@dawn16 This is amazing advice, thank you so much!

I have some new questions based on what you shared:

• I did NOT know about certain exercises working better in the higher rep ranges like bicep curl and cable row - I’ve been plateauing at 6reps for cable row so gonna try and drop the weight and hit 12-15. Thankful for learning this now! Out of curiosity, are exercises like lat raise the same too as I know I’ve plateaued on that for much longer than any other exercise and/or muscle.
• Are mass gainers being bad for you all just a myth as all the videos I’ve watched vilified it for it just having crazy amount of sugar? While I know dirty bulking is the easiest way, I’m also trying to take in as much whole foods as possible.
• I’ll have a look at the book though I’m still a little unclear about when to bulk/cut. Having bulked for a few months (~10 weeks) now, and now seeing that you shouldn’t bulk more than 12-16 weeks straight, I’m guessing I’m close to the point where I need to start cutting for about 6-8 weeks where I should not lose more than 10% of my weight during this phase, correct?
• I think my follow-up question to that would be, if at the end of my cut cycle, I’m still not happy with the physique - say for example, persisting belly fat, do I then continue to cut even though I’ve hit 6-8 weeks already or restart the bulk-cut cycle? Would it be normal to NOT achieve the goal physique by the first cut cycle and if so, I assume I would need to just rinse-repeat the bulk-cut cycles until I see results? I’m also struggling to understand the science behind it because if I don’t see the results I need on the first cut cycle, and I bulk again, wouldn’t that increase my body fat to a more unwanted level? And going back into a cut still won’t bring me to my goal, hence entering a vicious cycle?

 

[dawn16]

@caspernl I would take all the machine work and put almost all of it in the 12-15 rep range. Maybe one chest day do like 8 reps and the other chest day like 12 reps. Stuff like your cable rows will probably be better off at 12 reps or more. You could buy some grips for your back exercises.

Consider adding or putting in some neutral or assisted pullups just for fun. People love that stuff once they get hooked.

Edit : some kinds of machines and exercises are a bit tricky. Like my machine rear delt has a 15lb jump from 90 to 105. Thats a huge jump. I can get like 12 reps or more with 90 or even 97.5 but 105 I can only get 6.

In that case if you cant make 100 with the small add on bricks because of space you’ll have to pump out even higher reps with 90 something until you can get 105 for reps with good technique.

Goodluck man and I hope your jaw surgery works.

 

[melshizadek]

@caspernl It's not just about hitting a certain weight but more about body composition. Since you've already bulked up 7-10kg and feel it might be enough, it could be a good time to consider a cutting phase to trim down the fat and highlight your muscle gains. The transition from bulking to cutting usually comes when you feel you've gained sufficient mass or if the additional fat starts to bother you, as it seems to be the case for you.

During cutting, it's common to experience some loss in strength, but it doesn't necessarily mean losing all your muscle gains or being caught in a loop. The key is to maintain a high protein intake and continue your strength training, perhaps with slight adjustments to volume or intensity. This way, you can preserve muscle mass while shedding fat.

Regarding your routine, focusing on machine-based exercises is perfectly fine if that's what you prefer for stability. To enhance your V-taper and improve lat visibility, consider incorporating more variety in your back workouts, maybe adding some free weight or bodyweight exercises that target the lats specifically, like pull-ups or chin-ups.

For progressing in the gym, your approach of using the 8-10 rep range as a benchmark for increasing weights is a good strategy. It's normal for progress to slow down after the initial rapid gains, so don't be discouraged by the plateau. Consistency and gradually pushing your limits will lead to continued improvement over time.

In terms of managing your diet and workout routine, especially with the complexities of your condition and the precision required for effective bulking and cutting, you can go to a nutritionist or use some apps (i've used gaintrain for a while in the past). It can help streamline your meal planning even during transition between bulking and cutting phases.