Is there a 'formula' to help determine the appropriate rep range to use from the 5-30 range for a specific exercise?

[jdez]

People often say that the number of repetitions doesn't matter as long as you're training to failure or near failure, and any range between 5 and 30 works. However, this isn't the best answer because performing deadlifts or squats at the upper end of that range is not optimal; they are typically most optimal when done in the 6-12 rep range. Therefore we can't really say "rep range does not matter." I would argue it is more exercise dependent.

But aside from heavy compound exercise, I am not sure what rep range to choose for my other exercises, like is there some sort of formula to use? Is there such thing as "optimal range" for every single exercise? For e.g deadlifts 5-10, shrugs, lateral raise, and calv raises 20-30 etc..

For me personally I kind of use this formula for most my exercises: if its heavier compound then likely I am in the 10-12 range, lighter compounds I am usually in the 15-20 range, and pure isolation I am in the 20-30 range. Therefore I can use all the reps within 5-30 range. Alternatively in a perfect world I would solely dedicate dead-lifts and squats to only be in the 5-10 range but I suffer from chronic back problems and 10-12 is much better from an injury/pain management perspective.

Thoughts on this? I am curious about how you guys determine the number of reps, ranging from 5 to 30, that you'll use for a specific exercise.

 

[esmith87]

@jdez Whatever rep range you find easiest to achieve failure in for that movement, for me it's pretty much 6-10 for most things but everyone is different so there won't be a universal tool

 

[stewardmatthews]

@esmith87 I like this range. Work harder, but not as long. I was going the BBB workout and got good results but i always felt best in the 3rd week or the cycle when i was living heavy to failure/where i knew my next rep would fail WITHOUT having to do 20-30 reps of bullshit teice in the workout to get there.

I do less exercises, less time, more effort, and it def works better for me.

 

[baker5]

@esmith87 Adding to this, also make sure that the target muscle you are working on is failing when choosing the rep range.

Sets of 4-6 on a pulldown will more likely require you to use a lot more biceps unless you are very very strict with your form. Your biceps will fail earlier than lats at this case.

Aside from that, muscles of posture for me tend to respond to higher rep ranges. Just my observation.

 

[bulldogbrian]

@baker5

Sets of 4-6 on a pulldown will more likely require you to use a lot more biceps unless you are very very strict with your form. Your biceps will fail earlier than lats at this case.

that's what grips are for

 

[jdez]

@esmith87 I can reach failure on any rep range but usually lighter exercises I use 10-20 since something like 5-10 I would just not feel anything/no mmc just moving weight

 

[dawn16]

@jdez I think MMC is overrated for heavier compound exercises in the 6-8 rep range. Another way to think of it is finding exercises and rep ranges that give you the best stimulus-to-fatigue ratio (SFR).

For example, I really don’t know anybody who does RDLs in the 10+ rep range because that’s when fatigue and your cardio set in and you compensate by shifting weight to your lower back. For me, the 6-8 rep range is the sweet spot. Same with any barbell pressing, 6-10 rep ranges with a pause give me the best bang for my buck. But for almost all isolations and pump work, I’m in the 10+ rep range.

It’s best to just experiment with different rep ranges and just pick what you like. That’s the fun part.

 

[kpatrick1111]

@dawn16 Hello! I do RDLs in a 10-12 range. I have a hurt back and find it safer to do more reps with less weight. I can tell when I'm 2-3 reps from failure easier with a bit higher rep range. I can't/won't risk failing a rep half way through.

 

[dawn16]

@kpatrick1111 Rock on. Everyone is different

 

[heartfire]

@jdez Mind muscle connection doesn’t matter

 

[sugarcookies]

@jdez It's a bit of a mischaracterization in your first paragraph. It's not that the rep range doesn't matter; it's that it doesn't matter for the purpose of hypertrophy. That's not the same as suggesting that one should do, say, deadlift for 20+ reps.

If you're getting what you want out of the rep range you're employing for any given exercise, more power to you. No need to overthink it more than that.

 

[dawn16]

@jdez

1. Track your progress
2. Train with a certain rep range for ~4 weeks (basically enough time to average out any variance in your measurements/performance).
3. Double of half your rep range and train for another ~4 weeks.
4. Compare your progress from both these periods (did it improve, got worse, stayed the same?)
5. Binary search the optimal rep range.

Without measurements you'll just be making blind guesses.

 

[ojohn]

@jdez I try to keep my “formula” Simple:

8-12 reps for the compound movements for 5 weeks, then test my 1 rep max. If my 1 rep max is better than last time, ok to add more weight.

12-15 reps for dumbbells and cables. If I added weight to my compound lifts, I’ll move up in weight on the dumbbells and cables too.

 

[harley]

@jdez Where did you get the idea that high rep squats and deads are bad for hypertrophy?

Check out bastionhead on youtube, he does high rep breathing squats and he is pretty close to his natural limit.

Personally I do higher rep range too because I feel it's safer for the back and I hurt myself one too many after which I just said I go easy on legs and build my lower back up with higher rep range.

 

[justincann]

@harley ....what?

No, people say high rep squats and dead's aren't generally "great" for hypertrophy because high reps take the limiting factor more off the legs and onto your cardio and core. There's a reason they are called breathing squats. I also don't quite understand why you think higher rep ranges are "better for your back." I have never once taken squats or deadlifts to failure for more than 10 reps and had the thing that gassed out first be the legs. Its always the lungs and back.

Sure high rep squats to absolute load off the bar (and therefore your back). But you're stabilizing and holding the load with your core and back for far longer.

High rep squats and deads also are hell to absolutely systemically recover from once you get any level of respectable weight on your squat.

One guy doing high rep squats and having success is an N = 1. I mean sure it'll work. Its still intensity on the legs. Consistency and intensity always trumps "ideal". But there's a reason say, athletes who need to do lots of high rep, high intensity squat and deadlift work (such as Strongmen)....if you follow them they aren't doing squats all that often because it starts to take a LOT out of you.

 

[533th3r]

@justincann High rep squats and deads work, but at a very high cost. Once did an AMRAP on squats and hit 20 reps. I was absolutely gassed and my legs needed 7-8 minutes rest. So for hypertrophy it's not ideal or "optimal" at all. People wouldn't advocate for it if they could do a decent weight for 20 reps. It's killing.

 

[justincann]

@533th3r I’ll second this. Plus on basically any exercise like high rep Db bench or OHP I can feel confident controlling the weight up to 0RIR and safely bail and dump the weight.

20 rep squats at like…3 reps to go my vision starts creeping in at the edges even if 20 isn’t actually at/near failure. I have zero confidence of safely bailing if something goes wrong even with safety stops.

 

[sugarcookies]

@533th3r

Once did an AMRAP on squats and hit 20 reps.

To be fair, an AMRAP of 20 reps and a work set of 20 reps with a fixed RIR are different things. If a routine programmed 20 reps of any kind of big compound, it would be at an intensity that wouldn't kill the rest of the session.

 

[harley]

@justincann I don't go to real failure either. Just failure in perfect form and then stop it there. High rep Squats do seem to have a kind of anabolic effect, the 20 rep Squat program is said to be a great way to gain muscle fast.

 

[justincann]

@harley

Squats do seem to have a kind of anabolic effect, the 20 rep Squat program is said to be a great way to gain muscle fast.

Well yeah because the 20 rep squat program has you lifting a weight with some significant intensity.

I've done the 20 rep squat thing. Its....fine. But its more a feat to get through and a concentrated different form of intensity you keep psyching yourself up to can focus your training for more consistency and intensity than you were doing in a previous program. But its much like a number of brutal "squat every day" programs that basically leave you with enough energy for the rest of the day to consume calories and nap.

For strongmen or powerlifters who need the direct work capacity carryover? Sure. For anyone else I really don't see the risk:reward or stimulus:fatigue making sense over a more standard incorporation of squats into an overall routine. Especially since there isn't really any scientific evidence its actually better for growth.