Low volume workouts and the effectivity of ‘RIR-based’ training

[heartnsoul19]

@weepingwillow422 Yeah I wasn't planning on going full Yates mode and have a buddy get me 3 forced reps every set, that seems way too intense. I should probably just start going really hard on isolations and machines with proper form to get a feel for what failure really is, like you suggested

 

[dolphinsdream]

@weepingwillow422 High intensity does not equal high risk of injury.

Poor form causes injuries, not training to failure.

 

[weepingwillow422]

@dolphinsdream Cool. Not what I said.

 

[bk20257]

@weepingwillow422 Be careful bro, this guy watches Jay Vincent.

 

[dolphinsdream]

@weepingwillow422 Can you clarify what your position is regarding failure (or "beyond" failure) and joint injuries?

 

[joaa]

@dolphinsdream I've been a trainer for a while and one thing I always say is "Your training doesn't exist in a vacuum"

High intensity doesn't equal high risk of injury. But high intensity usually, in the real world, results in worse form. And if worse form causes injuries then you are more likely to injure yourself at high intensities than you are at lower intensities.

I feel like this should be common sense. You see it in studies a lot too. A low intensity always has more rectus femoris growth when performing squats than a high intensity group because they're able to stay more up right (ie use better form).

So high intensity on its own is not gonna fuck you up, but there are other things to consider.

 

[boyboy999]

@heartnsoul19 I don’t know if you need to jump all the way from one extreme to another. Realize that RPE 8 is freaking hard. If it’s not freaking hard, you’re leaving too many reps in reserve. It’s not really the best idea to train to failure on compounds. So I would keep your compounds using RPE, but actually take them to proper RPE. Push yourself harder than you normally do. Maybe do a block of RPE 9 training to help you find the groove.

Isolations, machines, dumbbells, cables, etc you can go to failure all day, no big deal. But there is no need to lower volume. You can go to failure and do 2-4 sets on a dumbbell curl for instance. Why only do 1? If you’re increasing relative intensity of course you’re going to have to lower total weekly volume some. But there’s no need to go all the way down to the 1 set HIT thing. That’s just another shiny program to hop to.

 

[heartnsoul19]

@boyboy999

Realize that RPE 8 is freaking hard. If it’s not freaking hard, you’re leaving too many reps in reserve.

I think this is it, every source says something different on how hard a certain RPE should be.

But there’s no need to go all the way down to the 1 set HIT thing. That’s just another shiny program to hop to.

Yeah I agree, there's no perfect program, but I think higher intensity is something that would definitely benefit me seeing everyone's responses

 

[boyboy999]

@heartnsoul19 Yeah there’s nothing wrong with trying high intensity. I’m just saying not to drop down to one set. You’ll have to drop volume to be able to recover, but you don’t have to drop it that far. Also don’t be surprised if you don’t respond as well as you think. Once you’re intermediate, things get really slow. Many people spend forever trying to get noob gains again, and that will never happen again.

 

[jontue]

@boyboy999 I powerlifted for seven years with accurate training in the RPE7-10 ranges and if you consider RPE10 as the point where you start having technique failure then RPE8 is not too bad.

 

[boyboy999]

@jontue Yeah well the point where you start to have technique failure is actually an RPE 7 or 8. So your RPE 8 you’re describing is actually an RPE 5 or 6. That can do great for powerlifting, but if someone is a late intermediate or advanced lifter with a goal of hypertrophy, that doesn’t really cut it unfortunately.

 

[jontue]

@boyboy999 Technique failure is about the same as actual failure for the main compound lifts (squat, deadlift, etc) if you are proficient at those lifts. Agreed on accessory machines definitely go past technique failure on them!

 

[jennywilliam]

@heartnsoul19 Sounds like you would do well to listen to JP. Very much of the mind set of 1 set to failure, and then beat it each week. As you progress you may need to increase the volume. Recommend you give his YouTube series a watch

 

[heartnsoul19]

@jennywilliam Never heard of him, I'll definitely give it a watch!

 

[bk20257]

@heartnsoul19 Check out DC Training (doggcrap training) by Dante Trudele it utilizes hit and rest pause