PPL or U/L

[hollowcreed]

PPL or U/L

I'm having paralysis analysis so i'm asking for some help.

I have been training consistently for the past 10 years. I was almost always on an U/L split. I have got a pretty nice physique with this. In the past year or 2 i have been starting to get a few overuse injuries here and there. I was trying different methods to compensate but it kept getting worse. At some point i had pain in my knee every time i squated even with bw, pain in my shoulder and in my elbow. I had enough and i decided to lower the frequency of training from 2 to 1. And i tried a PPL split that i did monday wednesday friday. In the past month all problems with my joints went away. I'm also feeling strong and well recovered. I also love the workouts. My only problem is that 1 time a week frequency that is not optimal. On the one hand all my joint problems went away, i like training 3 times a week because i have more time for other things and i love the workouts but on the other hand i'm afraid of losing gains so i'm constantly thinking of switching back to U/L which i also like by the way since i have been doing it from the begining and it has brought me all my gains.

What is your advice for me?

I basically went to 3 days a week because of my injuries and the injuries healed. That was my main goal. Secondary is muscle maintanence.

 

[davetownsend]

@hollowcreed I usualy split it like this depending on how many times a person goes to the gym every week.

1-3x full body

4x upper/lower

6x push, pull, legs

Currently my split is:

Mon: push/pull

Tue: run/skii/cycling (if indoors +bi,tri)

Wed: legs, core

Thu: run/skii/cycling (if indoors +bi,tri)

Fri: push/pull

Sat: long distance run/skii/cycling always outdoor

Sun: Swim

 

[hollowcreed]

@davetownsend So you go to the gym 3 times a week? Why don't you do full body?

 

[davetownsend]

@hollowcreed My legs would get slaughtered if i did them heavy 3x a week with 4x endurance trainig workouts around them.

And yes, iam kind of a hypocrite but it took me years to get a workout plan that works with my goals and lifestyle without feeling fatigued. The 3x fullbody is more of a basic template to start with, everybody will have to experiment and find what works for them.

 

[hollowcreed]

@davetownsend You're not a hypocrite. It just shows that the generic response of full body to everyone that say they can train 3 times a week is not appropriate.

 

[davetownsend]

@hollowcreed You are correct and i should have given a more thoughout advice from the start rather the just the typical template.

The cause of your pain could be from wear, that your muscle has developed uneven or both. You should set a workout plan that all joints used in a workout atleast have one rest day afterwards, and example is not to do tri or bi after chest and so on. In this case upp/low should achieve this. You would also like to do some accessary work for things that could be under developed, usualy it is rotatorcuffs, reardelts, core, glutes, might also want to look into flexibility.

I would also take a look at what movements hurt and look at alternative exercises, grip changes and so on. I had a minor tear in my triceps and noticed that a more neutral grip in most pressing exercises mitigated the pain and discomfort.

If you are eating at a big deficit it decreases the recovery time and the chance of injuries increases.

These are all probably things you already know but that is the tips I have from the given situation. You will have to experiment and se for yourself what program, exercises and so on that works best for you and your life.

 

[hollowcreed]

@davetownsend Thanks a lot for a thorough response. I was just wondering what would i lose in terms of PPL just 3 times a week since i like this split but it's not optimal. Recovery is optimised and i don't have any more pain. But i'm afraid of losing gains.

 

[davetownsend]

@hollowcreed Probably not anything noticeable at all, might even be better for you due to the ability to work harder. PPL works great and is perfect for someone that has joint problems due to the longer recovery times.

 

[hollowcreed]

@davetownsend Will do that. Thanks again.

 

[guaguar]

@hollowcreed Personally I go full-body for 2-4 days per week and 2-splits like upper / lower or torso / limbs for 4-6 days per week.

 

[hollowcreed]

@guaguar How much volume do you do?

 

[guaguar]

@hollowcreed Depends on the body part. Direct sets per muscle group is 15-20 for back and chest, 10~ for quads and hams, 5-10 for biceps, triceps, each shoulder head, and abs.

 

[hollowcreed]

@guaguar Nice.

 

[mike230]

@hollowcreed If you stay at maintenance volumes (which are a lot lower than people think) for another couple weeks, your connective tissues will probably be healed up.

You could probably do a PPL and be fine. Or a ULU rest LU rest split and also be fine. Though, I would say to do shoulders on leg day so you have enough rest.

For my joints, I started to lean more towards going at 8 reps than, say, 6. And up to 20 reps for isolations. For my knees, I started doing leg curls before squats and my elbows never became a problem once I started switching exercises out every 3 mesos.

 

[muskieman]

@hollowcreed You're unlikely to lose any gains training 3 times a week assuming you're hitting the minimum threshold for muscle maintenance which is pretty easy to meet.

However with 10 years training under you're belt I think it would be very unlikely to make any gains on anything less than four days a week, with 5/6 days being preferable.

My suggestion for your joint problems which I do my self and plenty of others do is to switch between what you're doing now and what you were doing previously.

i.e do your usual training for 10-20 weeks taking deloads as needed, then drop to the type of maintenance training you're doing now to let your joints recover for 4-6 weeks.

 

[mamabear2000]

@hollowcreed Increase the frequency of lifts and decrease the overall volume per lift, the nice part of PPL is how dynamic it is and by increasing frequency of lifts you can reduce the duration of each lift.

 

[jeremiahtee]

@hollowcreed torso/limbs