Honestly feel like the protein numbers that are given regularly are complete bullshit

[sendog]

@bronsontaur I guess this depends a lot on your individual needs, most protein recommendations are high, because they want to make sure its enough for everybody reading. If 160g a day are enough for you, but the next one with same height/weight as you needs 220g for whatever reason, a recommendation to aim for 225g a day works for both of you. Its just very generalized. Its also not wrong to go a bit over the top with your protein intake, as it helps other processes in your body aswell, at least thats what i was told by a friend of mine, who studied nutritional science.

If 70 to 80g a day work for you and you still grow while not seeing anything change when you take more, keep it as it is.

 

[joiner90]

@bronsontaur This sounds like one of those things that are very indivudual. I for one noticed a significant difference after starting to do an additional scoop of whey every day.

 

[phoebeamory]

@bronsontaur I personally tried this and I don’t think I noticed any difference either but I can tell you that I do feel a bit more recovered and stronger now adding back the protein. I had many reasons it was hard to get the protein. For one I cant do milk. I finally realized 25 grams of protein with water isn’t going to upset my stomach. And even 75 grams at night isn’t a problem and I don’t have a girlfriend right now anyway even if it were. Even if I did who cares really. Also, just eating that much meat is like force feeding. Thats like 3-4 large chicken breasts a day. Even getting double chicken twice a day at chipotle would barely cut it.

Protein is quite filling and doesn’t really cause any excess weight gain. You can’t really have too much of it as long as you get enough carbs and fats. I basically just take enough to make sure at the very least I hit the .82/lb figure by drinking three scoops of whey with water every night. 75 grams. I just make sure my other meals are at least adding up to about 75 grams or so at minimum. I usually hit 1g or more/lb. Finally getting the flavored whey and a blender bottle really helped.

I’m with you on not wanting to get all your protein from meat. It does seem a bit excessive. So that would be my solution. Especially when cutting I would recommend it as it is less likely to be used for energy, more calorically expensive to be used for energy, has a thermogenic fat burning effect and it is very satiating.

Incidentally, I actually stopped creatine this time around and I feel slimmer but maybe have less size in my muscles as well. But my numbers are going up better than ever. That being said, I would probably get even more results if I took creatine but I think that would probably just plateau after a few weeks and I would feel more bloated and less likely to fit into my clothes in a bad way.

Take as little supplements as possible so that you don’t overtrain and can get recovered from your workouts. Even caffeine. Save the extra calories and your Pre-workout formulas for a rainy day when you are absolutely stuck. And hopefully that never happens.

I think I was just overdoing everything and not listening to my body because all the supplements made me feel like more and more was the answer. Now without all the extra BS I feel I am doing the right amount of work to make slow steady progress.

 

[nick714]

@bronsontaur There are two things at play here.

The specific g / kg fluctuates a bit, but there is research to confirm a higher protein intake increases muscle gain. A recent meta analysis showed that 1,6 g / kg +/- 0,6g provided optimal results: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28698222/

But that doesn't mean that you won't grow eating less protein than that. It's more a scale of "food minimally support gains" to "food supports optimized gains".

Stronger by Science touched on this recently as well:

 

[blueruby]

@bronsontaur The only reason I eat more than any other is satiation purposes, I feel more satiated and full off protein than carbs and fats if I eat a ton of carbs I’m just hungry straight after

 

[tweetiepie]

@bronsontaur It all varies from person to person. If you’re new to training you won’t need as much (training < 3 years). Also depends on body composition. A 190 lbs individual who’s 12% bodyfat will need drastically more protein than a 190 lbs person who’s 30% bodyfat. More muscle mass requires more protein.

 

[gisellemartinez1]

@bronsontaur I feel the same, these numbers could be accurate if you're putting your body through fast muscle growth using gear.

 

[tweetiepie]

@bronsontaur Another massive factor to consider is that not all proteins have the same BCAA profiles nor absorption ratios. I aim for 0.8 grams per pound bw of high quality protein, such as beef, chicken, eggs, greek yoghurt, whey. Any secondary protein I don’t consider as part of my intake. I’m 198 lbs around 16% bodyfat and my protein intake averages around 220grams but 40 grams of that comes from secondary sources such as grains, wheats, green vegetables, carbs in general. I don’t count that protein as part of my target. 180 grams comes from meat, eggs and dairy. I’ve seen the best gains as a natural following this method.

 

[dasadler]

@bronsontaur I think it makes a big difference when cutting weight, not so much when bulking.

 

[mtk2010]

@bronsontaur I feel like women especially cut their fat macro SO low to make for these crazy protein macros, not realizing how important healthy fats. Healthy fats are so important for hormone health (Can’t really speak to men of course.)

 

[elenamaria_9]

@bronsontaur I don't think it's to push protein sales, but i think you're probably not far off regarding efficacy of slightly less protein intake.

Modern day fitness is still so young. Layne is is the grand daddy at what 40 yrs old? Then you could say that Lyle and schoenfeld are the great grand daddy's?

We've come so far very quickly so i don't think this is about big business conspiracy. At the same time, i think chasing absolute optimality is a waste of time. We all have so many hours in the day, with so many stresses and as I've gotten older, low volume but extremely high effort (rpe9 and 10 more than rpe8) plus being in a surplus with ABOUT .6-.8g/lb of protein will work indefinitely. If i stall on a lift, i will add like one set and drop the load a little to account for the volume increase and take it from there.

 

[qtipie]

@bronsontaur I've always done best on a slight caloric surplus and ~140 g protein a day at 160lbs bodyweight. Any less protein and there is a noticable recovery deficit for me but I've been eating high protein diets consistsntly for 10+ years. There's also the element of how your body adapts to high protein diets over the long term (like in terms of decades) which is something I'm still trying to figure out

 

[heareroffaith]

@bronsontaur your n=1 is meaningless unfortunately

if you've been training for hypertrophy for any length of time the potential muscle gains are so slow that it would be impossible to draw any meaningful conclusions as to the effect of different protein intake amounts.

you don't have a good way of measuring or have a control group

your feelings may be entirely accurate, but you can't know with any degree of certainty

 

[bronsontaur]

@heareroffaith Its the exact opposite of meaningless. All studies can do is give you averages and youre probably not average everywhere.

If i just stuck to what the science told me id be still doing high volume. Which doesnt work for me but works in lab settings.

 

[heareroffaith]

@bronsontaur you are correct that it wouldn't be meaningless if you had any way of accurately measuring and comparing results with everything else being equal.

you simply do not, so you are basing it completely on your feelings.

they may be accurate, but it's simply not verifiable in any way.

 

[laveencw]

@bronsontaur Not everything is a conspiracy. But most things I have seen talk about calculating protein based on estimated lean body mass not total body mass.

 

[suwon11]

@bronsontaur You are correct. A meta-analysis shows these numbers aren't necessarily accurate. A video on the subject:

View this content on Instagram

View this content on Instagram

 

[mkklee]

@bronsontaur If your goal is muscle growth, and you are happy with your progress by eating less protein than the general consensus is, please do that. What you raise here is an interesting thought, but since you fail to specify which studies you are referring to and what you define as "good growth", your conclusion is therefore unfounded.

 

[lisneige]

@bronsontaur Thanks mr (or mrs) anecdote

 

[melver2]

@bronsontaur In my 15+ years of lifting:

- I have successfully bulked at 0.64g/lbs.

- I have successfully cut on 0.64g/lbs

- I have successfully bulked on 0.50g/lbs even.

People really overthink this. Eat healthy and have around 40g of protein 3-5 times a day. That's really all there is to it.

Imo eating 200g of protein is raetarded - especially if you're a hard-gainer. It stifles your appetite, it's likely not very tasty (VS carbs) and it can be expensive. But to each their own. I'd rather "spend" my calories on stuff that's easy to chug down when I'm busy getting things done.