Looking for encouragement..

[olives]

@thingi

Do you have mfp set to the correct activity level?

I have it set to sedentary.

How often are you weighing in?

Once, or maybe twice in a week if I'm being fiesty.

Are you tracking the calories you burn in mfp towards your total calories intake?

No, I'm not.

Are you tracking foods raw or cooked? There can be a big difference here

Cooked calories if they're eaten cooked. Raw calories if they're eaten raw.

When I started I had similar stats at 6’2 285 and got to 255 in about 3.5 months eating 2k-2200. My maintenance at 255 is ~ 3k although I don’t have a sedentary job I track it 1 level above that.

Yeah, this is why I'm really thinking creatine is playing a heavy roll here because I've done a diet around this level before when I was around 275 and I lost weight FAST eating around 2k.

2.2k calories should still ABSOLUTELY be netting me some weight loss, but I think after reading a ton of threads about people's real world experiences with creatine water weight gain (some people mentioning up to 8kg gain without changing diet or exercise over 1 month's time) that it's just my body retaining a ton of water.

 

[thingi]

@olives Alright I’m going to use my own numbers and the fact we’re doing similar ish things.

At 500-1000 you should still have seen a loss in a month. Creatines loading phase is 7-14 days. You’re likely capped on water weight after that. I had steadily been losing 2 pounds a week for the last 30 days eating 2150 cals a day and exercising 4 days a week. Hoped on 7 ish days ago and I’m up about 3 pounds. So I’d attribute that to water retention of about 5 pounds.

Sedentary tdee for 6’4 300 is ~2700. So math it out from there. If you’re averaging 2200 you’re only in a 500 deficit. That’s 1 pound a week, 4.3 pounds a month. Add in your exercise of 2k burned a week (guesstimate) another 2.5 pounds lost in a month. So total loss should have been 7 ish pounds while it’s possible you’ve held onto 10.3 pounds of water I’d still have expected the scale to move 3-5 pounds down with the activity you’ve stated and tracking.

I’d weigh yourself daily to start tracking your weight trend at this point. You should be seeing a steady loss on almost a daily basis. Make changes every couple weeks to get progress going and I’d get in a bigger deficit personally.

If you’ve eaten clean and in a deficit for 3 days and exercised you should be seeing the scale move at this point.

If this was happening to me 1st place I’d look is how accurate am I really tracking? Is my deficit sufficient to get where I want to go? Is my tdee lower than I was expecting therefore my deficit is also smaller?

 

[olives]

@thingi

At 500-1000 you should still have seen a loss in a month

I, too was under that impression.

Creatines loading phase is 7-14 days. You’re likely capped on water weight after that.

I didn't load. 5g/day. 3-4 weeks till full saturation.

I had steadily been losing 2 pounds a week for the last 30 days eating 2150 cals a day and exercising 4 days a week. Hoped on 7 ish days ago and I’m up about 3 pounds. So I’d attribute that to water retention of about 5 pounds.

You may retain more.

See this thread here where I counted around 7 different stories of people gaining 10-18lbs within the first month strictly from starting creatine supplementation. Or another thread here with another 5+ stories of 10lbs+ of water retention from creatine use.

I had been reading everywhere that 5lbs was the upper limit of what you could gain with regards to water retention from creatine use. But it looks like that's just "normal" or "average" with 0lbs variants and 18lbs variants existing alike.

Sedentary tdee for 6’4 300 is ~2700. So math it out from there.

I'm getting 2,850 as a low end. So the math says:

Over 4 weeks I should expect to have "lost" 18,200 calories or 5.2lbs.

That's not including any workouts (which average around 4-500 calories burnt actively, not total) that I'm doing 4x per week along with 3 walks per week that average around 450 calories burnt as well. Or, as the math would say:

Another 12,600 calories burnt or 3.6lbs lost.

Meaning 8.8lbs should have theoretically been lost in total.

This number could be on the lower end depending on if my TDEE is higher since I used the lowest one any estimator gave me.

So total loss should have been 7 ish pounds while it’s possible you’ve held onto 10.3 pounds of water I’d still have expected the scale to move 3-5 pounds down with the activity you’ve stated and tracking.

We're within 2lbs of one another with calculations so I'd say that's well within the margin of error.

I cannot state for sure that my first weigh-in one month ago was on a particularly high water retention day or low one since it was the first time I'd weighed myself in over a year. There's an absolute non-zero chance that I've actually not even responded to the creatine whatsoever and that my water weight had fluctuated greatly that first weigh-in and my real weight was higher then than the scale read.

I’d weigh yourself daily to start tracking your weight trend at this point.

This is 1,000% what I got to do. Your voicing this opinion along with several others has completely convinced me of this.

I’d get in a bigger deficit personally.

I find it hard as it is to get the prerequisite amount of protein at 2,200. Any advice on getting there on less calories?

If you’ve eaten clean and in a deficit for 3 days and exercised you should be seeing the scale move at this point.

Absolutely agreed.

If this was happening to me 1st place I’d look is how accurate am I really tracking?

I'm a math freak. I feel quite accurate in my tracking.

Is my tdee lower than I was expecting therefore my deficit is also smaller?

What's the potential here? How far off can those calculators be? I've never heard of anyone talking about them being greatly wrong with anyone's TDEE before... so I've never really considered it. But I suppose not everyone's body and genetics can be fit under one formula.

If I come across like a dick in this, apologies. I'm genuinely trying to interact with all your points of which there were many.

 

[thingi]

@olives There’s a lot of good info in the thread and alot of it echoes the same points. There’s more at play than creatine here. The extremes you’re referencing are on the end of the bell curve and shorter time frame than a month in most cases. Go read studies and not threads.

As far as me gaining more Idc if I’m outlier and I gain another 5 pounds from it. I know my deficit is working aside from the scale this week as I hoped back on. I know where my deficit needs to be to make the scale move based on my activity on a weekly basis.

There’s alot of ways to cut calories to every food group. Idk what your meals look like to say specifically. Pasta on a cut isn’t it for me and neither is using percentages or estimations. Especially when you’re searching for answers. Micromanage tracking to a single piece of shredded cheese or a single gram of pasta. Every piece of every meal gets weighed. Cooking in oil add it, sauce, seasonings. All of it. If you’re eating 2200 of actual food and don’t track that stuff it’s easy to wrack up 400 calories and then you’re at a 200 deficit for the day and not going anywhere fast. This topic is where it hurts. You’re the only one making that choice and if it’s wrong it’s 100% on you. Tracking incorrectly is by far the easiest way to slow or negate and progress. Personally this is where most people including myself mess up and I’d bet the problem lies regardless of your confidence.

Your main goal based on the reaction to the scale is losing weight. Treat it as the priority. Sure you can build muscle as you diet down but it’s not efficient nor optimal. You don’t need 300 grams of protein. You don’t want to be 300 pounds right? Eat for where you’re going not where you are. Unless you want a 2 year long cut lose the weight, establish new habits to maintain your goal weight and only have to do this 1 time. Then work on recomp and building muscle from there. You’ll still retain most of the muscle you currently have, you’ll hit your goal weight sooner and recomp faster because you’re doing things more efficiently and optimal.

 

[olives]

@thingi Where did you get 2,700? I’m seeing 2,850 as the lowest pretty much anywhere.

 

[thingi]

@olives It’s really beside the point. It is likely just difference in calculators. The 150 calories difference we’re using in our math is not making any noticeable changes in the end. 1000 calories a week is less that .3 pounds.

 

[havevisions]

@olives Bro dropped some good knowledge to point out where your shortcomings may be to help you break your plateau and you’re pointing fingers over a +- 150 calorie hypothetical.

I think you should revisit your deficit or tracking habits and consider taking some of the advice everyone is giving. We’re all trying to help you achieve your goals, if you were doing everything right you wouldn’t be in this predicament.

Sometimes its a tough pill to swallow when we make mistakes or aren’t progressing but the journey isn’t going to be easy, you can also consider visiting medical professionals to help you find your resting metabolic rate and see if you have any underlying health conditions that may be effecting your weight loss or if you have some sort of allergic reaction to creatine.

I am not 30+ but I run bulk and cut cycles constantly and move bodyweights between 145 to 187 upwards or downwards of 30+ pounds. Usually when I approach a plateau it means I’m doing something wrong or I need to pivot macros, cardio, daily steps, or calories.

Best of luck to your journey

 

[olives]

@havevisions My man, I’m taking care of a six month old who’s sick and I have half a reply typed up to him. I asked a quick question. It isn’t that deep.

 

[havevisions]

@olives My man, I’ve read through enough of your detailed comments and replies where you quote everything someone brings up and you explain why that can’t be it. But it’s your health and wellness and not mine, so don’t worry it’s not that deep to me.

 

[olives]

@havevisions Maybe your advice sucks? I'm not reaching or breaking plateaus lol, you'd know that if you'd actually read this thread like you say you have.

Saying I'm "pointing fingers" is most ridiculous thing I've read today. Just. Go elsewhere.

 

[havevisions]

@olives Lol for the fitness 30 plus you seem more like an immature teen lifter upset with why no progress is shown when they “know everything and are doing everything right” none of us will have better advice than reaching out to some medical professionals. Maybe bring this up at your next doctors appointment and get a referral for a specialist. My advice might suck and might be wrong like you said, your network of health professionals know your body best not us couch quarterbacking on reddit.

Like I said, I’m wishing you the best of luck in your journey but it seems more like you are here for validation that Creatine is the result of your lack of expected progress. Good luck brother hoping you achieve your goals this year for the sake of your own health and family.

 

[steve_yavli]

@olives I think your calories are too high. I am a similar weight to you. My daily calories for a loss are around 2000. I am losing steadily.

 

[olives]

@steve_yavli How much are you losing? What’s your exercise like? Are you taking creatine?

Everything else equal, you should be losing 1,400 calories (less than half a pound) a week more than I am. I assume you’re losing somewhere around 1.5-3lbs per week. Less than one half of a pound would not put me in a surplus compared to you.

 

[steve_yavli]

@olives Since October, I have lost 29 pounds.

 

[olives]

@steve_yavli Then it sounds like you're losing around 1.5lbs per week. If I were losing half a pound per week less than that with my caloric deficit compared to yours, I'd have lost 4lbs so far instead of gaining 2.

So. Something else is awry.

 

[steve_yavli]

@olives You do you

 

[rsm777]

@olives there are 2 numbers that are the closest to accurate; the calories you count from your food, and your scale weight. if you were on top of it and honest, your calories should be accurate +-100-200 cal. your scale should be set in the same place and used almost everyday.

if you count 2,200cal a day and your scale is the same or going up, you are simply eating more than you need to be to lose weight. eat less food.

you dont need to get into the weeds of what your bf% is or what your TDEE is. these are VERY gross estimates, and can be unhelpful because they burden you with math you really dont need to be doing.

 

[olives]

@rsm777 And creatine plays a non-factor here for you?

 

[rsm777]

@olives i think if you were really at a 500-1000cal deficit every day for a month, you'd be down in excess of extra water weight. 500-1000cal is actually a very big deficit that would impact your weight on a weekly basis.

the fact that you didnt lose weight isnt necessarily a bad thing, and at your size you might have recomped some. but you're probably wrong about how much you should be eating to lose weight.

 

[olives]

@rsm777 For what it's worth, I'd say I'm drinking a substantial amount more water (and also eating far better quality food) over the last month than I was doing in months/years prior.