Next steps, Need advice

buckbran

New member
Been lifting consistently on a PPL program for now ten months. 22, 6’. Started off at around 220lbs and probably mid to high 30s b/f. Currently at 176lbs, 22b/f and unsure of where to go from here.

If I wanted to get to 15 percent, I’d need to lose about 15 lbs, continuing the cut for another 2-3 months. But at this point I’d like to actually start building muscle as i feel I’ve squandered my “newbie gains” lifting while on a 500-1000kcal deficit for ten months. I don’t really want to maintain as I’d rather see progress on either end (losing weight or gaining muscle). Just not sure where to go from here. Continue cutting until I hit 15 percent, or bulk a little to around 185-190lbs and then return to a cut after having built a few pounds of muscle? Thanks for the advice!
 
@buckbran In no way an expert but I would prioritize the look since I assume that’s what your chasing. If it’s about impressing the ladies go for a maingaining approach or a small surplus to gain mass while still keeping a better shape. However, if it’s strictly about ripping that weight off the ground in a deadlift or throwing plates around in the gym then a healthy bulk would be your best option. What I would recommend is dialing in your sleep and your training to really maximize your efforts. Also 176lbs at 6’ is a very healthy weight, how do you figure the 22% bf? What do your numbers look like with compound movements and how much considerable muscle do you notice?

I wouldn’t say you’ve squandered newbie gains either as it seems you haven’t really tapped in to them yet from your assumptions.
 
@clearlightgrace Hey man thanks for the response. Definitely more about aesthetics than power lifting. Sleep and training are definitely dialed in, but lifting as much as can be while on a cut. I would say I’ve gained muscle for sure (as previous to this I had no lifting experience) but of course while cutting it wasn’t the “optimal” amount. That said I wouldn’t say my muscle mass is considerably noticeable as I do have some visceral fat on me. The 22% bf figure is from a dexa scan, I wanted to see my progress at this stage.

I do think I either go ahead and lean bulk it, or I cut to about 160lbs to hit 15% bf, but I’m really not sure which one I should be aiming for
 
@buckbran My advice would be, since you just finished what seems to be a long and fairly aggressive cut just maintain for a bit, maybe the summer, and you'll make good gains. If you say you made gains on the cut and were basically a beginner, then you'll definitely still make gains at maintenance. Probably more gains. Then once you recomp a bit and get rid of some diet fatigue and your gains start slowing you can bulk and take advantage of the newbie gains. Newbie gains don't just go away or become unavailable if you don't get then within X amount of time training, it's just that most people can get them in some amount of time. But If you cut hard first, you'll only have gotten a fraction of the easiest gains to get, but some of those easiest gains to get will still be in the months immediately following your first bulk when beginning training. It would still probably do you good to maintain for maybe 8 weeks or so after stopping a deficit and get used to maintenance and let your body get back to a healthy baseline, and then start bulking slowly.

I see you say you don't want to maintain, but you'll still see physical changes for a few weeks after finishing a cut and switching to maintenence, especially as a beginner. Your muscles get fuller and you feel better physically and mentally and your strength starts increasing again or keeps increasing or increases at a faster rate if you're new enough. Your metabolism also gets used to this new "set point" and you will be able to eat a bit more and still maintain once you adapt.

I also love data and seeing numbers go up and down, especially on the scale, but if you and I worked so hard to lose weight and we can still gain strength and muscle at this lower bodyweight, then why not stick here for a bit and then increase mass when that's the only way to keep the numbers on our workouts going up?

I think you can gain enough muscle that maintaining for a bit and then going on a lean bulk would be much more beneficial than either just starting a bulk and gaining much more than ideal unnecessary fat or cutting more, hurting your gains, and then bulking back up to and beyond what your at now. I mean would it be much better to cut to 160 in like, 8 to 12 weeks and then spending 12 weeks to regain those 15 lbs, or whatever your ratio and rate of gain and loss is, than it would be to maintain for like 12 weeks and then lean bulk for 12 weeks such that in the same time frame you end up at the same weight but at least this second way you are only maintaining or bulking whereas the other method you are in a deficit and then a surplus, but are much less anabolic in general?

Honestly I have no idea, but I think if you cut you won't look shredded anyway. You should gain some muscle and settle in to your bf% before bulking again. Imo. I've done it and I've seen it, but I was disappointed after my first cut to low bf because I didn't have a good enough base of muscle. And that takes a while to build. I'm happy this time, but it took way longer than expected. I'm still happy with it, but doing hard cuts to low bf early on isn't necessarily worth it ime.
 
@sehnsucht9 Yeah the last point you bring up is one of my fears. I just won’t have enough defined muscle for a longer cut to really look that good. My concern with maintaining is only that it’s not as efficient for muscle growth as a lean bulk, but as long as I do gain muscle then maybe it’s worth it. Thanks for the input! I’ll definitely consider what you’ve said
 
@buckbran I would say it comes down to what you want my man, I’f you want that cut look then go for the diet, if you like a little more size but not as ripped go for a clean “bulk” I’d like to stress that at the little experience you have lifting especially when eating enough a large bulk is not needed. Really a 500kcal or 1lbs gain a week would be plenty. It will help you not get too fat. Ideally I would even cut that in half but I understand wanting to lift more.
 
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