[progress] 31M, 5'10 135-155lbs, 3 years [long post/pictures]

[solarflare]

Why am I posting?: I've always planned on posting something, but didn't get the true motivation until yesterday. I've lifted for 3 years with two 2 months breaks (so 32 of the last 36 months).

One of the guys I talk to at the gym came up to me today and said after chatting a bit, "I see you here all the time. You're always getting it. Why're you so small? To be honest, you look like you don't lift." First, he was being kind of an asshole, but I don't think he was meaning to. He's a good guy and I took it in the spirit it was given. Second, uh, yeah. I've made little progress over 3 years and haven't made any progress in the last 3 months. So here's my post.

To bracket everything... I'm going to be as honest as possible. This means I'm not going to sugar coat bad behaviors (lie) and then not figure out where I can improve as a result. My post isn't to complain; it's to get better.

Pictures: https://imgur.com/a/bEGViNv

Background: Been small my whole life. 5'10 and thin. At my lightest I was 125lbs and about 20% BF. I've never been skinny fat, but always very "soft". I only played tennis and soccer in high school. I was literally too weak to effectively play games that required any upper body strength. I've always been active, however. I played sports. Ran track, slowly. I was a cyclist in my 20s. Basically, my story is I was never the fat kid or the uncoordinated kid. I was always just the worst, slowest, weakest of the athletic people. In my late 20s, I decided that I'd be willing to put a lot of effort into lifting. I was tired of being the smallest man everywhere I went. I was willing and able to grind when I cycled (cycling is a suffer-fest as far as training rides); I was in graduate school (now getting my PhD). I'm not a stranger to putting an intense amount of energy into being good at something. So I started lifting in 2017. I was so weak that I started with the bar and slowly (over the course of a year) worked up to two 35 plates. As you're going to see, I am way stronger than I was, but absolutely, verifiably, weaker than most untrained men if they put 1-2 months into training.

Weight: 135lbs (2017) -> 155lbs (2020) stayed maybe 20-25% BF the whole time

Lifts (1RM, all calculated):

• Barbell bench: 170 (Dumbbell: 75)
• Deadlift: 205
• Squat: 195
• OHP: 90
• Barbell row: 155 (One armed dumbbell row: 80)
• Curl (Dumbbell): 54

Diet: Very clean. Whole foods for ~90%, meaning tons of raw/cooked/steamed veggies, tons of fruit, whole grains (brown rice, wheat pasta), greek yogurt (whole fat), milk (2%), and lean meat protein (chicken and egg whites). Supplement with whey protein. I get whey protein through a glass of water + one scoop after workouts and protein shakes with kale + fruit (banana or strawberries) + ground flax seed + milk + two scooops powder. They don't taste great but they are healthy and tons of fiber and protein.

I stopped drinking since COVID19. I usually just socially drank 1 or 2/week and just vodka/water. I used to smoke weed 1/month. Stopped that last year when my wife broke my bowl and, fuck it, I just never replaced it so I stopped that.

I do eat cheese with some of the Tex-Mex I make and I love block Parmesan cheese on my edamame and whole wheat pasta. That's probably the unhealthiest thing I eat regularly. Otherwise, as far as shitty food, I eat pizza probably once a month and a burger once a month. I don't eat dessert really. My wife eats a couple scoops of milk-free ice cream at night sometimes and I'll usually make her give me a bite or two. Maintenance is ~1950. I eat about 2050-2150 a day now. I track calories/macros. I get about 150-170g protein a day (usually closer to 160g). For a few months I went up to 2500 calories, thinking my progress was due to too few calories. I got marginally stronger, but from the mirror it was clear I was just building a spare tire, not getting jacked. Probably got up to 25% BF over 3 months. This has made me scared to eat too much more than 100 or so over maintenance.

Sleep: 7.5-8.5 hours a night. Twice a week, on average, I sleep my regular time but I wake up frequently in the morning, so I'm pretty tired the next day. This doesn't cause me to skip workouts, but I would be lying if I said I get good sleep.

How I work out: I warm up my major lifts with 2 easy sets, and then I do 3 working sets. I do every set to failure, on every lift I do. (Only recently did I realize that not everyone did that.) I do this because I don't want to go easy and not make progress. Most workouts take an hour and 15 minutes. I work as hard as I can on every workout I do. If I'm not getting stronger (I'm not), then I just try to push myself harder. I superset about every lift with another muscle group to make my workouts more efficient. This means if I do bench press, I then do rows about 60 seconds after, and then back to bench about 120 seconds after. If I do squats, then I do curls 60 seconds after, and then back to squats 120 seconds after. I generally don't superset things that will cause me to fail my next set. If I bench and then do triceps work, I won't be able to finish my sets for example.

I never miss a workout. There are zero skipped days. Motivation is not a problem because I look forward to every session. It's the best part of my day. I love the feeling of just being totally wiped after a workout. Sometimes I'm tired, but I always go in. For example, I just finished a hard workout and I'd go back in and do another workout right now if I knew I'd be able to do the work and recover from it.

Program and timeline: As a scientist by trade, I meticulously record my daily lifts. Have recorded nearly every session for past 3 years, including notes on whether I failed on reps, whether my form slipped, or when certain workouts seemed to irritate my shoulders.

• mid/late-2017 (135-145-135): I started off with a beginner Allpro program that used to be linked in /r/fitness but isn't anymore. It had a 3 times a week full body program to teach you the lifts as well as progress steadily through your newbie gains. Did this for a year. Although I was taking whey, I was not focusing too much on protein. I was getting about 90-110 grams a day. Gained 10 pounds of some mix of muscle/fat. School got intense and I took about 2.5 months off. I lost 8-9 pounds during this time, putting me at about 135 again.
• late-2018 (135-150): Got back into it and didn't look at scale. I was frustrated to see how much lighter I was so I avoided scale for awhile. This was a mistake. I got stronger but didn't gain a ton of weight. About 5 pounds after 6 months of lifting x3 week on Allpro program again.
• Started adding more volume and eating more. Got up to 150 and stayed there for a few months.
• 2019 (150-156-150): Wasn't getting stronger, so I tried NSUNS. From 3x a week to 4x a week. Started eating more because weight gain had stopped (added about 250 calories). Got my lift numbers to the above (now at 156lbs). Then my shoulders started hurting. Not during lifts, but the night and day after. (I was also playing volleyball and running on top of workouts). I thought shoulder pain was volleyball, so after a while I quit. Then the pain would just be constant. Eventually I stopped lifting for 2 months in late 2019. Orthopedist said it was rotator cuff tendonitis. Just needed time off and PT.
• After 2 months, I was extremely weak again. Lost about 5 pounds (150). Back to benching/rowing 95ish, etc. I could only do lifts that kept my shoulders stable and low, so this meant the upper body lifts I was doing were shrugs, curls, and triceps pushdowns. But now with strengthening rotator cuff and scapular muscles as well as time off, my lifts didn't seem to cause me any problems.
• 2020 (150-155): Now I've been lifting for 6 months again; 4x a week. Doing the Frankoman's dumbbell routine recommended on /r/fitness. They're easier on my shoulders. Instead of the dumbbell leg work though, I'm just doing squats, deadlifts, and leg presses, as well as some hip flexor strengthening work I got from my PT. I'm back to my lifts from last year (I still lift barbell occasionally, but most of my workouts are with dumbbells right now) and now at 155 again. Still eating at a surplus.
  • In the last 3 months, I've not really gotten much stronger week over week. Looking at my lifts from March, I'm lifting about the same. This is with working out, consistently, this whole time. Lifting to failure, eating enough. But every time I go into the gym, I can't do more than I did last time.

So... I'm still weak. Literal 14 year olds come into the gym and put more plates on than me. I see progress posts on here and elsewhere and I'm always like "holy shit, that is not like me. What's the secret recipe?"

Would really appreciate advice. What do you see that I can improve? Looking forward to your thoughts.

 

[dawn16]

@solarflare Here’s my quick take. I’m not trying to be a dick or claim to know it all. I have gone from 175lbs to 230lbs over the course of 3.5 years. I too started with an empty barbell on ALL my lifts. Currently my deadlift is hovering around 540lbs, overhead push press on barbell is 240lbs, Swiss bar 230lbs, strict press 200lbs and squat is 427lbs. All these lifts are on video either here or in IG so it’s verifiable. I only say this so you know I’m coming from a similar background as far as training goals and where I’m at now. You seem to be exercising but not training. I rarely push anything to failure. I have a set plan going into each workout and know how many reps I need to get each workout. Once in awhile my plan will say AMRAP and 3 reps is a PR and if I feel good and know I can finish I’ll push for a 4th rep. I try not to ever fail lifts. It’s psychologically tough I think. You get confidence and keep things positive when you complete a plan. Some days I feel wiped from workouts and some days it’s easy work. I work with sub-max weights and cycle through percentages week to week. (Wendlers 5/3/1 philosophy) I would rethink your plan of constantly training to failure. Your recovery plan needs to match your workouts and lifestyle. You may have to back off the intensity occasionally to let yourself heal and actually build the muscle. As far as diet adding a few dirty calories won’t hurt because you need them to fuel your training and recovery. Look up Jim Wendler and read through some of his Q and As . Despite the website you’ll find them on they are informative and helpful. He’s a genius for gaining strength. Perhaps a little old school and def not for everyone but try and take the informative bits out. Good luck!

 

[seekingtoserve]

@dawn16 Just for point of discussion... I agree pushing to failure on your top set consistently is probably not a good idea, but once in awhile I'll tell myself I'm going for broke (without doing something dumb form wise) and going to see what I can do. I don't really fear failing a rep as I think it is a good tool to know exactly where my limits are and where I need work. We might be on the same wavelength here... Just offering perspective.

I like Wendler, but he's a bit too dogmatic at times for my liking. I think he is just used to people asking the same dumb questions over and over so he makes it really black and white. Obviously he has had way more success than most everyone, so I can't really criticize his methods.

On tier 2 work, I'll push to failure on the last set pretty consistently either through dropsets or just one straight shot.

We seem fairly close in lifts... Squat hovering close to 4 plates, 335 bench and now 575 DL (up from 550 in May!) @ 210 BW, so different philosophies definitely work!

 

[dawn16]

@seekingtoserve Ya I can safely agree that we have the same basic methodology. I don’t train to failure that often but yes I will recognize when a day is going well and try to take advantage of that and push everything harder. And def during comps and sometimes comp prep I’ll goto failure on certain things. My old coach was a big proponent of pushing assistance work hard like 15-20 reps where the last rep is a struggle so again similar ideas. I am just thinking as a novice you haven’t learned to recover or what you can safely handle so going to failure every workout is prob not the best idea.

I think Wendler made his basic ideas pretty dogmatic so it’s easy for the masses to follow. Do this don’t do that. As you get more advanced and learn about yourself it turns into just doing 50 reps of push and 50 reps of pull so you are free to do whatever you need to work on.

Bench I’m curious to see where I’m at I never bench anymore really well seriously. I was just under 315 when I stopped and started serious strongman so the focus went to OHP and log.

 

[seekingtoserve]

@dawn16 Cool, yeah I'm jiving with you, especially on the novice part. I've never really tried too much push press, but have been wanting to try. Any tips or resources you'd suggest?

 

[dawn16]

@seekingtoserve Martins Licis and Brian alsruhe have good vids on pressing mainly with a log but the principles are the same regarding leg drive. Slow dip, knees out and explode up getting triple extension. Keep your elbows high during the setup especially with a log or you’ll press out instead of up and make it waaay harder.

 

[solarflare]

@dawn16 Thanks man.

I can't follow programs that well because I rarely meet the next week's weight/rep increase. So I just kind of spin my wheels.

Could I be over fatiguing myself, even on 3x/4x workouts a week? Doesn't seem possible. I've heard over and over that no one really over-trains, so you should never use that an excuse not to work hard.

 

[dawn16]

@solarflare It’s not so much over training as under recovering. Constantly going to failure will eventually wear you down if you aren’t supplying enough calories etc. If your goal is weight gain and strength then you also need to track food calories . I am currently stuck at a plateau myself at 226ish . I wanted to push to 240lbs but I can’t break 230 . I know I’m not eating enough plain and simple. I know you said you are eating at a surplus but if you aren’t gaining then you aren’t. That part is pretty simple. Online calculators only give you a ball park. The real results are in the scale. If you aren’t gaining week to week then it’s not enough. Add 500 cal more not just 250. I used to train 4x a week but felt beatup so much. I dropped to 3x a week for quite awhile now and feel much better. I’m seeing more consistent improvements too. I’m just now slowly adding a 4th day back in. I work a lot of hours, have a busy family and home commitments. You have to factor all of that into your recovery. My first plan I followed was starting strength. Pretty Simple to follow and 3 days a week I believe .

 

[solarflare]

@dawn16 Yeah I'm gonna start eating more.

I did my last workout without going to failure and just added another set instead--damn. It's way less draining but you can fit in more quality work. On bench rather than killing myself on 3x8 I went down 5 lbs in dumbbells and did 4x14 leaving one/two in the tank. Feels like I got a way better workout.

 

[dawn16]

@solarflare Sounds awesome ! I always try to leave 1-2 in the tank during training. Unless I’m calling for a specific AMRAP for a comp or something. I try not to have too many grinder sets. They can be good sometimes for mental fortitude but every session shouldn’t be like. It’s just exhausting lol so try and stick with your new rep scheme for like 6-8 weeks and see. And you should be adding resistance or more reps or something weekly or workout to workout. That way you can track progression and see the improvement . And promote growth. And eat!!!

 

[amotz]

@solarflare If I'm getting this right; your a scientist by trade, you work out consistently, eat decently, track caolories, get enough sleep, have motivation, but just not seeing results?

It would be helpful to know more about your goals, what would you like to achieve?

 

[solarflare]

@amotz Just to make consistent progress in muscle growth and strength. I'm 5'10 so 155 is not very big with medium to high BF. I'm certainly not hitting my limits.

 

[amotz]

@solarflare The consistency in which you are applying your training and diet seem like they should show better results. Using myself as a reference point - I was once 125 and hit 155lbs from lifting, I trained less consistent, never counted calories, lifted for around the same time range as you, and didn't have any specific program except the good old chest/back/legs/arm split days - and I was seeing good results in strength and muscle growth. So I'd agree that you may not be hitting your limit. Just surprised at how thats the case given your meticulous tracking on top.

It's hard to pin point a single area, but based on your goal and what you've been doing, it might be a diet that lacks sufficient calories for you to make the gains you want.

 

[solarflare]

@amotz Hey, thanks for the reply.

I've been thinking about upping my calories more. I think I will. I just got nice and doughy the last time I went 300 calories over maintenance so I have been hesitant. I only count calories to make sure I eat enough. Otherwise I just go nowhere since I eat clean. It's hard to accidentally overeat on a good diet because it just takes so long to eat more calories.

 

[marinemike]

@solarflare Possibly low T.

 

[solarflare]

@marinemike Say more. Because nothing else explains my shit progress?

 

[solarflare]

also, paging /@seekingtoserve because your progress was insane and I wanted to get your thoughts after we talked a month ago

 

[solarflare]

@seekingtoserve Yeah beginner on all lifts.

I'll stop supersetting my main lift. Lifting to failure + supersetting another compound lift also to failure = probably not optimized I'm realizing. I just get bored waiting, haha.

I'm gonna make the shift to stop supersetting main lifts and stop lifting only to failure and see where that takes me. If nothing changes I'll get on GZCL.

Doc says I could try TRT, but I don't know if I should do it just because I have stupid weightlifting goals. We'll see!

Thanks for the advice!

 

[renatusfueritexaqua]

@solarflare My first recommendation to anyone struggling is always use a DeLorme/Watkins approach first.

There are modifications to this popularized over on Dave Draper's Forum that de-emphasize the middle set and this is a good way to go. Also, this method uses relatively easy volume up front and one hard working set of 10 RPE. I often use Rest/Pause or occasionally DropSets to increase intensity on the last set and increase volume with a heavier weight.

The lead in sets should not impede your ability to use a max effort on the last set. Once you're done you should not want to do another set. this doesn't mean go to "gravity wins" failure every time, but you should go to technical failure (90% certain you cannot get another clean rep). The standard application is

10 reps with 50% of your 10 rep max weight

10 reps with 75% of your 10 rep max weight

10reps with 100% of your 10 rep max weight

Commonly modified to only 5 reps on the second set.

I use a first set at 10-12 reps close to failure - RPE of about 7-8

second set with heavier weight about 3-4 reps - RPE of 4-5

third set using the same heavier load AMRAP plus a Rest/Pause AMRAP repeat after a 30 second pause. RPE 10+

there should be at least two days between targeting a muscle group or major effort on a push,pull,hinge,squat. Accessories OK, but if hitting it hard you need two days off on the biggies. Also, you probably don't need more than one or two exercises on Accessories, and 2-3 for main movement lifts. Remember if you are training hard your body only gets bigger and stronger on rest days - in the gym you actually break yourself down/set the table for improved adaptive response.

I like that you superset to save time, but probably (if possible) should superset upper/lower exercises.

Remember to eat, eat, eat. Protein, 30g per meal, 4x day spaced out 4-6 hours. Keep ingested fat on the low side and stick with low fat, whole food carbs.

 

[solarflare]

@renatusfueritexaqua Thanks for the advice. I'm getting a lot of comments that failure on all sets isn't the way to do it. Also that I shouldn't superset my main lifts.

How many sets are you doing for each major movement per week? I usually only give myself a single day rest.