What is the proper scapular and thoracic positioning (aka form) for the support hold?

[ndubuisi]

I couldn't really find a sufficient answer in the FAQ or the wiki page on support holds.

To my understanding the support (both rings and parallel bars) requires that the scapulas be depressed.

The variations which I have seen is combinations of the following scapula and thoracic positions (assuming the scapulas are depressed):

Scapula:

• protracted scapula
• neutral scapula
• retracted scapula

Thoracic:

• neutral thoracic
• extended thoracic (picture of full thoracic extension)
• flexed thoracic (picture)

My question is, which combination of the above scapula and thoracic positioning is correct?

Is it different for parallel bars compared to rings?

I was under the impression that it was neutral scapulas (besides depression) and neutral thoracic positioning - or at least aiming for this scapular thoracic position.

Any thoughts?

Below I have compiled the different types of support holds that I have seen and my perception of their scapular and thoracic position (forgive me if the positions are incorrect):

Person
Scapula Positioning
Thoracic Positioning

Antranik (Rings ( 1 ) ( 2 ), Parallel Bars ( 1 ))
Neutral/Protracted (Rings), Neutral/Protracted (Parallel Bars)
Neutral/Flexed (Rings), Neutral/Flexed (Parallel Bars)

Tom Merrick (Rings ( 1 ))
Neutral/Protracted
Neutral/Flexed

Nick-E (Parallel Bars ( 1 ))
Neutral
Neutral

FitnessFAQs (Rings ( 1 ) ( 2 ), Parallel Bars ( 1 ))
Neutral/Protracted (Rings), Neutral (Parallel Bars)
Neutral/Flexed (Rings), Neutral (Parallel Bars)

Calisthenic Movement (Rings ( 1 ) ( 2 ), Parallel Bars ( 1 ))
Protracted
Flexed

Bodysthenics (Rings ( 1 ) ( 2 ))
Protracted
Flexed

Surpassing Gravity (Rings ( 1 ))
Neutral/Retracted
Neutral

Strength Side (Rings ( 1 ))
Neutral/Protracted
Neutral/Flexed

Ryan Hurst of GMB (Rings ( 1 ))
Protracted
Neutral

Thanks in advance!

Edit: fixed some "protracted" when it should be "flexed" in the thoracic column

 

[fromgenesistorevelation]

@ndubuisi Neutral/protracted is clearly the consensus.

 

[ndubuisi]

@fromgenesistorevelation Is that for scapular positioning? What about for thoracic positioning?

 

[fromgenesistorevelation]

@ndubuisi Thoracic should be neutral. Just note that "neutral" for t-spine is kyphotic (slightly flexed = neutral).

 

[ndubuisi]

@fromgenesistorevelation Alright. Yes you're right "neutral" is indeed slight flex

 

[medic75]

@ndubuisi I’m going to suggest you might be overthinking things …

 

[ndubuisi]

@medic75 Perhaps, but wouldn't you like the know which position is optimal?

 

[qtpie71]

@ndubuisi

Lock out the arms and depress the shoulderblades

https://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/wiki/exercises/dip

I think maybe we used to have more content about this...

 

[ndubuisi]

@qtpie71 Well can't find anything now

 

[tka_tn]

@ndubuisi

1. Between scapula retraction or protraction, basic support holds tend to be more neutral. Depending what you are about to do some protraction or retraction is common.
2. The thoracic spine will be more neutral.
3. Remember support hold positions are considered as momentary resting position in competitions.

 

[ndubuisi]

@tka_tn

Between scapula retraction or protraction, basic support holds tend to be more neutral. Depending what you are about to do some protraction or retraction is common.

Ok tendency towards neutral is what I thought, maybe I'm observing it currently and they are actually more neutral.

The thoracic spine will be more neutral.

That's what I thought but as you can see the Calisthenics Movement guys love a super flexed thoracic.

Remember support hold positions are considered as momentary resting position in competitions.

Yes I know it's just that I'm coming back from a shoulder injury and I practice them sometimes during the beginning or the end of my workouts sometimes and would like the to know the correct/optimal position.

 

[deborah123]

@ndubuisi My opinion of the ideal: Neutral and depressed scapulas and neutral thoracic just training it as an exercise.

There are some reasons why you may want to do neutral/protracted scaps and neutral/flexed thoracic like some gymnastics movements though.

 

[ndubuisi]

@deborah123

My opinion of the ideal: Neutral and depressed scapulas and neutral thoracic just training it as an exercise

Sounds good

 

[from]

@ndubuisi Good, thorough research. I would like to know as well. Currently can't do much due to tennis elbow and itching to get back into it.

 

[ndubuisi]

@from Yeah I'm just coming back from a shoulder injury so I would like to know as well

 

[thedog1]

@ndubuisi Well, this really depends on what you aim to do after you have mastered your support position. For example, if you want to prepare for planche then depress and protract your scapulae and create a bit of kyphosis in your thoracic combined with posterior pelvic tilt. However, in general terms you want to depress/protract your scapulae and keep the thoracic spine neutral.

 

[ndubuisi]

@thedog1

if you want to prepare for planche then depress and protract your scapulae and create a bit of kyphosis in your thoracic combined with posterior pelvic tilt.

I believe /@rfoobs and the folks over at Labcoat Fitness actually discussed this. How having a neutral thoracic rather than a flexed thoracic (kyphosis) is more ideal for planche. I'll see if I can post some links.

However, in general terms you want to depress/protract your scapulae and keep the thoracic spine neutral.

Sounds good

Edit: Links Naterman's post, another one, LCF Post