Am I doing too much?

[thex]

I’m 20 years old, female
145 bodyweight, 5’6”
Goal of competing in CrossFit.
I train 2-3 times a day
Usually 2 hour strength in the morning
one hour zone 2 cardio in afternoon
and then more lifting and a metcon in the PM
I have been having SUCH a hard time gaining strength
And I’m so thorough with everything, that’s it’s very frustrating
I track all my food,
get 7 hours of sleep
track my water
take creatine, fish oil
all the things, lolz
any Advice for what I should maybe change?

 

[buckswordbearer]

@thex Past high level competitor here.

There is no universal "too much", but your post may contain the answer to you question, or at least point to the answer, right here:

I have been having SUCH a hard time gaining strength

You're doing all the things, but it's not getting you the results you want. Something is not working. Strength gains should be pretty easy to come by, especially if you're kind of early in your career, which I assume because you said

20 years old, goal of competing...

So you're young and you're not an advanced competitor. You should be gaining strength somewhat easily at this stage especially if your food and sleep are on point.

It is likely you're doing too much. Again there is no universal "too much" but when your effort isn't yielding results, you're hustling backwards as we used to say in New Orleans. You may have reached and exceeded the point of diminishing returns.

If I were you, and you're serious...this isn't just a passing idea...I would break down each aspect of your fitness: strength, skills, conditioning, etc and figure out where I am vs. my goals in each domain, and then design your training plan that way. Apportion your time based on what you actually need, and resist the urge to do more and more.

I've been there, I get it...but you have the evidence, so it's probably time to assess things and adjust.

 

[swammerdami]

@buckswordbearer Agree with this totally! Personally I wasn't gaining strength and my weightlifting coach told me that I need to hit my strength days fresh. There isn't exactly a too much but he removed any strength more than 5 reps per set from my programming. He told me that I was big enough and hypertrophy was not going to help me. I felt way better and he was right. I could train strength more often and feel good doing it but most of all actually gain strength.

But like you I was training 3 times a day. My cardio and muscle endurance were top class but my top end 1 rep max strength wasn't.

 

[vulcanlogician]

@buckswordbearer Did someone say Rhabdomyolysis

 

[markstrimaran]

@thex Former high level competitor. Please sleep more. 7 hours is likely not enough for the amount of training your doing. Our bodies need sleep to recover and athletes training as much as you do often need more than the average person. Not only will it help prevent injury, it helps your muscles to adapt and grow.

You didn’t mention rest days, but make sure you’re taking them as well. Your body needs them to adapt and grow.

Other than that, I would sincerely consider getting a coach. They’ll help to ensure you have a solid structured plan without overtraining and will help to relieve some of the stress of “am I doing enough”

 

[catiebug]

@markstrimaran These were the first three things I thought of as well.

I am just a solid 90th percentile athlete. Training 5 days a week for a couple hours and my body likes 8-10 hours of sleep.

I would probably add some body maintenance on those rest days too. OP is young but if she wants to continue with CF long term this has definitely helped me maintain as a 31M going on 9 years of CF.

Lots of programs out there but no one is programming for you (OP). Fining a coach and possibly a nutritionist as well if she’s serious about it we’ll be very beneficial.

 

[chrisss7]

@markstrimaran Agree with sleep - that number jumped out at me. It's well worth your while to get super nerdy on sleep. Invest in a tracking deice that measures breath rate as well as everything else. Do research. Don't listen to me or "the Google" get out and talk to real people. Sleep can be one of the most anabolic things you do; critical hormones are released during sleep.

Here's something interesting to dig into. Research is pointing to the fact that the most productive sleep happens at the END of the sleep cycle. So if your optimized zone happens between hours 6-8 and you're only getting 7 hours then you're missing out on 50% of your necessary sleep (i.e. not recovering fully and starting each day "in debt")

 

[josephugo]

@thex The rest cycle is so important. If you want the best get a trainer to help optimize your training sessions so you can get the rest cycle in knowing you did all you can. 2 a days is the max I would push for. Active recovery is also an option but the rest is crucial for strengthening muscles.

 

[tmcleod]

@thex At that training volume you should be eating 8g per kg of bodyweight so like 500+g carbs and since you’re a young woman you probably want to be eating like 90g of fat and 145g of protein. Do you eat 3500cals per day?

Not only should you be in a caloric surplus if you want to gain strength, you’re also probably just experiencing the concurrent training effect. A bunch of stuff happens on a molecular level with cell signaling but basically it’s hard to gain strength if you are doing anything aerobic/glycolytic. The more your non-lifting volume increases, the more you will struggle to gain weight.

I’ll sing it from the rooftops:

If you have aspirations of being a competitive cross fitter, stop doing CrossFit. As a woman you need to squat 305-335, snatch 190 clean and jerk 235. Spend time getting strong and just practice your skills. Don’t test them, don’t try and like do crazy volume, just do a couple c2b, some mu, some double unders here and there. Like once every 10 days or something so you don’t lose the movement pattern.

Once you’re that strong then you can do metcons and cardio but up until you’re that strong you’re best served to only do strength work.

 

[antcart]

@tmcleod That is the irony of Crossfit. To get better at it, you don't do Crossfit.

 

[londonleah]

@tmcleod So in your opinion you don't try to improve or maintain your engine at all during this period of focusing on making significant strength gains?

 

[tmcleod]

@londonleah I think you can touch it like 1x per week if you need to but I think if you’re trying to maximize strength gains the less time you spend doing aerobic work the better.

It is significantly easier to maintain strength while focusing on building your engine. It’s much harder to gain strength if you’re tying to maintain your engine.

It makes more sense to prioritize strength and gain strength as fast as possible (basically get it over with, check that box) then maintain your strength as you improve your aerobic fitness.

 

[comingfrom]

@thex Rest & probably eat more

 

[ioannes]

@thex 7h of sleep holy moly. How do you even stay alive?

 

[markstrimaran]

@ioannes Lol I read that and thought the same thing. If I could go back in time, I would sleep more. I’ve learned it’s truly one of the most important things both physically and mentally

 

[lovinjesus4ever]

@ioannes Why did I have to go so far down to find someone telling OP to sleep more? If you're training that much, then you need to be sleeping at least 8 if not more like 9 hours a night. This is actual asleep time, so that means 9+ hours in bed with the lights off and no screens.

 

[ioannes]

@lovinjesus4ever With 3 trainings a day I would at least sleep 10h (including naps)

 

[hktm]

@thex As a Coach, I have encountered this the box I worked at a few times.

First…understand that you get weaker when you work out; you’re putting stress on your body and it super compensates during the resting phase.

Second…understand that movement is good. You don’t have to push yourself every single session. My advice would be to meet with a reputable coach and formulate a training plan for you. Most CrossFit gyms program their WODs to appeal to the masses; they want the best WODs for the greatest amount of members , CrossFit is also a business.

If you tend to go stir crazy because you’ve been so active consider doing low impact low intensity such as walking, rucking, bicycling, or yoga. You’re still going to move the needle in the right direction.

Lastly you’re going to need to dial into your nutrition. You’re going to constantly need to fuel your busy for the training demand.

In conclusion if you are truly dedicated to competition it’s going to be a lot of work and a lot of sacrifice. I would recommend listening to some Ben Bergeron podcasts to understand how his athletes work.

 

[polygonon]

@thex We've had a few very high level competitors at our gym, and we used to host several of the very elites (Annie, Katrin, Ben, and Mat) when the Games were in SoCal years ago, and did a round table with a bunch of competitors one year. The key takeaway was that cardio/metcon work does not matter AT ALL until you can reach baseline levels of strength and gymnastic proficiency. I don't remember the exact numbers, but for men it was something 275 lb snatch, 350lb C+J, 425 squat, 525 deadlift as general guides (probably 10% higher today), and then proficiency in muscle ups, handstand walks, strict deficit HSPU, and legless rope climb, where proficiency is like you could do double the volume of that mov't from a previous games workout.

So you basically focus all your energy and effort on those two facets, while trying to stay as lean as possible to make the gymnastic stuff easier, then as you get close to competing you work on building your metabolic engine and V02 max to its peak.

Otherwise, everyone gets to the same point you are, where they're training a ton, but not seeing the strength gains they need to have a shot at being competitive.

 

[jameszo]

@thex If you truly have competition aspirations you need a coach. Coaches. A coach to write all of your programming right down to the last band stretch. A likely a nutrition coach. I would suggest reaching out to Underdogs, Training Think Tank or one of those camps.

This forum is not the place for advice if you are truly wishing to compete.