Apparently I suck at zone 2

@aachen_hexagon I am a former marathon runner and it took me years to figure out how to sustain a run in zone 2. It takes time to figure out your pace for zone 2 because it is much, much slower than you think. When I switched from my main sport being marathons to CrossFit and I started actually trying to run in zone 2, I would keep my watch on the heart rate screen so I could pace off of that. I would suggest giving that a try; don't run to pace, just your heart rate. It will be slow and that is the point. My marathon pace was 7:57/mile, which I can still do just not for a full marathon, and my zone 2 pace is about 10:45/mile.
 
@aachen_hexagon You need to slow way down. The easiest way to Zone 2 for people who just want Zone 2 benefit is a stationary bike.

Running is strenuous for most people who don’t do it a lot. You’re bigger, too, so just by that it will be more strenuous.

You need super flat ground, and if not then prepare to fast walk a lot of hills. It shouldn’t feel taxing at all. It’s your “steady state” cardio like your all day gear. And I mean all day. Like if you were stuck in the wild with days of travel to get out you’d preserve energy, right? But you’d move toward your goal consistently. That’s the gear.

When I started Zone 2 as a runner I was running like 12 minute miles. It was crazy how slow I had to go.
 
@richardsonmommy5 I can't do either, I'm confident I'm in zone 4. I guess I wasn't clear and updated my question. The crux would be, I getting the same benefits from an hour of zone 4 vs an hour or zone 2 or part of the magic of zone 2 that I can use it complimentary to all the other stuff I do as opposed to zone 4 which is more of a replacement?
 
@aachen_hexagon I agree about watches being finicky. I'm all over the place when I'm running, and sometimes I have to chalk it up to the sweat and the bouncing. Even if I run super slowly and barely break out of a jog, it still tells me I'm in 3-4. If I'm running a steady, pace, it almost always tells me I'm holding at zone 4. Basically, what everyone else said: if you're comfortably going out and running for an hour (and you don't want to die at the end), then you're fine. If you're collapsing into a pile at the end of the trail, then you probably need to dial it back.
 
@aachen_hexagon If you're spending an hour in "zone 4", it's not your zone 4. Calibrate your zones to your actual max HR.

To be clear, I'm not saying the HR data is wrong, I'm saying the zone numbers are meant for someone else and you need to customize them to yourself. For example, I'm 43 and so my max "should" be 177. In reality I reach 185 easily and my max is somewhere around 200. Default settings for most wearables give me a similar experience as you--they'll say I'm in "zone 4" when I'm really in my zone 2.

What's the highest HR you've ever seen on your monitor? Go into the settings of your HR app/device and see what it has your max HR set at. I bet there's a big difference between those numbers.

ETA: to answer your bottom-line question, if you are actually in something like zone 3 for an hour, the benefits of that will largely overlap with zone 2 benefits but incur some more fatigue. Better to get into a true zone 2 if you can, but it's not like you're completely wasting your time or anything.
 
@anon103 That's not true, i spent 2h in zone 4 during my half marathon.

Max HR 197bpm, rest HR 52 bpm.

Run average 172 bpm, took with a garmin hrm pro plus
 
@mahk On race day, if you're really pushing yourself, yeah mid to top of z4 is appropriate for most of the latter half of the run. My numbers are similar to yours for the last time I did a half marathon I was well trained for. I think average was in the low 180s.

But for somebody who's going out for "an hour run" and that's just part of their normal training? It's a lot less likely that's a real z4.
 
@aachen_hexagon I have the same issue. I think it's partly our size. I'm 6'4" 225 and my hr will not stay in zone 2 when I run. However, if I ride a bike I can get to zone 2 and stay there for long periods. My theory is I am not supporting my bodyweight on the bike the way I am when I run so my hr doesn't need to pump as hard.
 
@aachen_hexagon I am a regular cross fitter 5 days a week but enjoy running, biking, surfing ect. I am also a big dude (6’4” 220 lbs). I have tried hard to get into zone 2 via my whoop but have really struggled. Best I can do is zone 3 (139 bpm) running an 8:59 pace for 4 miles. I guess I can try and dial back my pace even more but it’s a struggle. For reference, my normal cadence is around 7:45-8:00 for 4 miles running around 148pm.

Instead, I find cycling a much easier zone 2 training. I can bike for 2 hours, have some sprints up a hill or passing someone and still average 116 heart rate which is prime zone 2. I will
Continue to try and get zone 2 running but for right now it seems slightly out of reach. However when I started this early in the year, I average 144 on the reduced pace so there is improvement. Not sure if it’s just the focus on reduced pace or the combination of cycling increasing my stamina.
 
@aachen_hexagon Zone 2 can be very hard to stay in while running for people who are not runners. Basically, most people have shit running efficiency so any amount of running raises their HR out of Z2 pretty quickly.

Z2 adaptation is entirely different from Z4. To properly build Z2, you need to stay in that zone exclusively for extended periods of time, an hour is the absolute minimum. Many crossfitters seem to struggle with this concept and think you can do 20 mins of Z2 here, 20 mins there and it all adds up. It does not. Z2 adaptations, like any stress adaptation, happen when you create enough stress for your body to make an adaptation. If you walk at Z2 for 20 mins, you will never make an adaptation because there simply isn’t enough stress. It’s like doing a set of 1 back squat at 20% of your max. That’s just not going to effect any change, it lacks the proper stimulus.

Z2 requires two things: Actually staying in Z2 the entire time and working in that zone long enough to elicit a stress adaptation.

The first part can be challenging. Going by HR is not the most precise metric and wrist/light based HRMs are almost unusably bad. If you want to train in Z2 based off HR, get a proper chest strap HRM and link it to your smartwatch or phone. Next, HR varies by personal stress, time of day, outside temp, etc. You will also get something called “HR creep” where at the same power output level, your HR will go up and up over the course of a workout. The best way to do Z2 accurately is on an erg with a watts/power meter setting. Basing Z2 on power output is the hands down best way to train Z2 because it eliminates all the bad HR data.

If you must use HR (basically if you’re running or walking), try to stay closer to the bottom of the zone at the start of your workout to account for HR creep and try to do your workouts at roughly the same time of day, same time after meals, etc. To eliminate as much HR variability as possible.

The next thing is just staying in the zone. It can be very difficult to stay in the zone, you’re an athlete, you want to run fast! Just don’t. I don’t have the time to look it up now but there is some good peer reviewed studies showing that going out of Z2 mid workout is detrimental to your base aerobic training.

The other key factor is of course, time. To make Z2 stress adaptations, you have to go long enough in Z2 that low intensity becomes hard. Same as anything, the lower the intensity, the longer the time and vice versa. This means about an hour is the bare minimum for making training adaptations. If you want to really see results, shoot for more like two or three hours. Pick a good audio book or podcast and just walk easy. As you become more aerobically fit, your speed will increase but, and I cannot stress this enough, DO NOT PERSURE SPEED AS A Z2 GOAL. The exception is if you’re training for an endurance event or whatever but even then, the biggest issue I have with endurance athletes I train is they want to go hard on a Z2 day and they just blow up the training.

Z2 is not exciting. Z2 is boring as shit so just lean into it. Walk slow, enjoy the sights, talk to your mom on the phone, she misses you. Just don’t try to go fast or “get it done quick”
 
@aachen_hexagon As others have stated watch based HR readings can vary a little and what your HR zones may be off especially if you’re using the 220-age calculation. That being said, you’re probably not off enough to read Z4 while actually being in Z2.

Z2 training is something that you have to adjust to mentally and physically. Mentally because sometimes you may need to stop and walk, if running, for your HR to drop back down even though you know you can push harder. I find it notably harder around now when temps are first starting to climb and your HR rises faster.

To answer your question regarding an hour of Z2 vs Z4, to me the real benefit of Z2 vs 4 is the amount of volume over days/weeks you can accumulate while being able to recover which you wouldn’t be able to manage if doing everything in a higher HR zone.
 
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