Balancing alcohol with physique goals. What the research says

[great_depression]

I put a summary at the end under "Overall Conclusions" but I highly recommend reading this entirely.

The caloric value of alcohol​

Protein:

• 4 calories per gram

Carbs:

• 4 calories per gram

Fats:

• 9 Calories per gram

Alcohol:

• 7 calories per gram.

However, some will argue that like protein, there is a Thermic Effect of food with alcohol which means not all of those calories can be used and that it could be more around 5.6 calories per gram. For this reason, you may see people recommend a slight deficit or a slight surplus on alcohol consumption days.

All nutrients have a thermal effect. However, one difficulty in comparing the effects of macronutrients on energy expenditure is the problem of being unable to manipulate only one macronutrient at a time under the experimental restriction of eucaloric feeding..

A brief introduction to what the Thermic Effect of Food (TEF) is:

TEF refers to the slight bump in metabolic rate that occurs after eating, due to processing and utilization of the ingested nutrients.

• Protein has to be broken down and processed in the liver which requires energy. As well, the simple act of eating protein stimulates protein synthesis in various tissues (organs, liver, muscle) as well. All of which takes energy.
• Carbohydrates get broken down to glucose, which goes through the liver, some processing, etc.
• Fat undergoes the least processing.
• Alcohol: Alcohol is treated as a poison and the calories from alcohol are used to generate adenosine triphosphate (ATP) in order to detoxify it.

As it turns out, different nutrients have different individual TEF’s. Protein turns out to have the highest, to the tune of 20-30%. Meaning that of the total protein calories you eat, 20-30% is lost in processing.

[.]

Protein is just one example. It happens with every macro to some extent

It should be noted that tracking and counting for the effect of TEF is usually not worth the time and effort and the effect it has is marginal and should already be accounted for if you are tracking your calories and body weight. As you should be.

But what if I just drink hard liquor? No calories, right?​

This is misinformation and you've probably heard it a lot. While it's true that hard liquor does not have carbohydrates, it still has calories.

My recommendations for alcohol tracking​

After researching this topic, I would personally recommend you treat it with 1:1 at 7kcal as it is just simpler.

If you are the type to have a drink at night and essentially have incorporated it into your diet then it is crucial to:

• Track and log your daily weight and caloric intake. Keep track of how much alcohol you drank the night before. So weigh what was left.
• Keep your other fluid intake consistent (water) as well as your alcohol consumption (in moderation please).
• If you do this long enough you should be able to still have a decent estimate of your maintenance calories.

How do I adjust for alcohol?​

Eric Helm's method

• Consuming alcohol means you automatically revert to calories and protein, or just calories.
• If you drink 400 calories of beer with a maintenance of 2,630cals (200P/300C/70F) By consuming alcohol, you now are simply focused on either hitting calories and protein or just calories.
• After drinking the 400cals, you would then have 2230cals left for Protein, carbs and fat. Finishing with a +/- 100kcals after hitting your desired macros for that day with protein taking priority as far as macros go.
• The goal is that you have hit your energy balance quota for that day which is the number one goal and your protein requirements.

This, however, is assuming you are drinking a moderate, disciplined amount. You should not consume more than 15% of your total daily calories from alcohol.

Andy Morgan's method

Fortunately, we can take advantage of the fact that the body has trouble storing anything but dietary fat in the short term when we go over our calorie balance for the day.

So, on days that you know you are going to drink a lot:

• Keep your fat intake very low,
• Eat your protein target for the day to preserve muscle mass (lean sources such a chicken, egg whites, casein protein), restrict carbs to veggies.
• Try to drink shots, dry red wines (they are lower carb), or spirits with zero-calorie mixers (I like Coke Zero and whiskey).

[.]

Layne Norton's method:

Alcohol acts like a fat but it also metabolically acts like a carbohydrate because it reduces lipolysis.

In fact just 24g of alcohol is all that is needed to achieve this. [.] [.]

With a 99calorie beverage as an example.

• If you count alcohol as a carb, carbs being 4kcal per gram, 99/4 is 24.75g. So you would then count it as 25g of carbs.
• If you want to count it towards fats, 99/9 is 11. So you could count it as 11g of fat.
• You can also count it as both. 5g of fat is 45kcals. 99-45 is 54. 54/4 is 13.5 (14). So you could say 14g of carbs, 5 grams of fat.

If you choose to include alcohol while trying to lose body fat, it is important not to sacrifice your protein requirements or exceed your daily caloric intakes that will keep you in a deficit. I personally feel that the inclusion of alcohol in moderation, is appropriate for building a lean muscular physique if the above considerations can be adhered to.

[.] For an in-depth read from him.

Does alcohol affect weight loss?​

[.]

• DeCastro and Orozco (1990) found that alcohol supplements rather than displaces food-supplied calories.
• (Cornier et al., 2002). Looking at actual changes in weight or body mass index (BMI) rather than calorie-source replacement, a prospective study by Wannamethee and Shaper (2003) found that, over a five year follow-up period, mean body mass index and the prevalence of men with a BMI of 28 or greater (i.e., top quintile of the BMI distribution) increased significantly from the light-moderate to the very heavy alcohol (defined in this study as 2 or more drinks per day) intake group even after adjustment for potential confounding factors.
• However, a prospective study with a ten year follow-up (Koh-Banerjee et al., 2003) found that changes in levels of alcohol consumption were not associated with changes in waist circumference. Over a shorter timeframe, Cordain et al. (2000) found that the addition of two glasses of red wine to the evening meals for 6 weeks did not adversely affect body weight.
• Obesity results from an imbalance between energy intake and energy expenditure over a prolonged period of time. Given the energy content of alcohol (7.1 kcal/g, as compared to 4.5 kcal/g for protein, 5 kcal/g for carbohydrate and 9 kcal/g for fat), weight gain attributable to drinking could arise if corresponding food intake was not adjusted sufficiently to maintain energy balance.
• Thus far, the evidence on the relationship between moderate alcohol consumption and obesity remains inconclusive.

Doesn't it suppress your metabolism?​

Take a look at this study done by Sonko BJ

We conclude that alcohol has a fat-sparing effect similar to that of carbohydrate and will only cause fat gain when consumed in excess of normal energy needs.

The study does show that it does supress fat loss during consumption but that effect goes away after it is metabolized.

But doesn't alcohol make you store fat?​

• This study shows that the oxidation of dietary fat slows down substantially after alcohol consumption. Which means that dietary fats are more available to be stored.
• However, a recent animal model study designed to evaluate the effects of chronic moderate alcohol intake (5% ethanol in drinking water) on energy balance using male rats that are maintained on either a low-fat or a high-fat diet suggests that rats fully compensate for the excess calories associated with alcohol and maintain energy balance regardless of the fat content of the diet (Cornier et al., 2002)

The conclusion to this is that your daily energy balance still greatly determines what happens. Although it may be beneficial to alter your macros for that day. Leaning towards taking calories away from dietary fats.

Some notes from Layne Norton on the topic:

• Weight Loss: Fletchner-Mors et al. (2004) placed two groups on a 1,500kcal weight loss diet. One group got 10% of calories from white wine and the other group got 10% of calories from grape juice. Subjects on both groups had similar weight decreases and similar decreases in body fat %, waist circumference, blood pressure, blood glucose, insulin, triglycerides, and cholesterol
• Weight Gain: A study by Cordain et al. (1997) placed participants in a 20-week cross-over trial. In one 10-week period, participants consumed 190ml of wine per day on 5 days per week. In the other 10-week period, participants did not consume alcohol. Calories were maintained the same in both parts of the trial. No weight changes were observed when participants consumed alcohol compared to when they remained abstinent.
• Calorie Intake: Caton et al. (2004) compared energy intake and hunger after 0, 1 and 4 units of alcohol. It was found that 4 units of alcohol increased energy intake and subjective hunger but 0 and 1 did not - showing there is a threshold where alcohol can increase appetite and food intake
• Overall: Alcohol won’t cause you to gain weight or interfere with weight loss as long as calories are in check.

Conclusion on whether it affects fat loss​

As far as weight loss and weight gain is concerned, most experts agree that while things can get complicated, from a thermodynamic viewpoint, a calorie is of course a
calorie. If you do not take alcohol past your caloric maintenance, do not drink heavily and very often, then it will not affect fat loss other than something so statistically insignificant that it doesn't matter and won't show up in your averages.

If you're already dieting, don't worry about it.

How does alcohol affect fluid intake?​

Eric Helms. Muscle & Strength Pyramid book.

Include all of your fluids except for alcohol. Yes, even things we see as “dehydrating” like coffee, actually do more to contribute to your fluid intake than detract from it. So all fluids, including coffee, diet soda, milk, juice, tea, flavored waters, and any drink (besides alcohol) will count towards this intake. Don’t count alcohol because it is, in fact, dehydrating, and makes you urinate more fluid out than you take in.

Muscle Damage & Recovery (How it affects training benefits)​

Study

This study examined the effect of acute ethanol ingestion on other indicators of muscle damage: force generation, muscle stiffness and muscle soreness. Ten women subjects performed two similar exercise regimens, one with each arm, separated by at least 10 days. There was no significant difference between the alcohol and nonalcohol conditions for any criterion measure. It was concluded that acute ingestion of alcohol has no effect on several indicators of exercise-induced muscle damage.

Study

Four hours post-match, participants consumed either beverages containing a total of 1 g of ethanol per kilogram bodyweight. It seems that alcohol consumption during the evening after competitive rugby matches may have some detrimental effects on peak power and cognitive recovery the morning after a Rugby League match.

While the first study shows that it will not affect you, the second shows that if you get hammered then it will. The conclusion is to yet again, drink lightly and in moderation.

Muscle Protein Synthesis. (MPS)​

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3922864/

In conclusion, the current data provide the novel observation that alcohol impairs the response of MPS in exercise recovery in human skeletal muscle despite optimal nutrient provision.

there was a hierarchical reduction in MPS with ALC-PRO (24%, P

 

[anglic9823]

@great_depression This is an awesome write up my friend. Should be added to fitness wiki’s everywhere.

Appreciate the time you put in to create this amalgamation all of this research. For people who are health-oriented but like to drink socially, this is filled with knowledgeable takeaways.

Edit: words is hard

 

[loulou1]

@great_depression What's the point of getting shredded if thots can't take shots off your abs?

 

[frustrated]

@great_depression I have two favorite hobbies and they’re counterintuitive: I love working out. And I love getting hammered.

I watch my protein religiously and I watch my calories in a more passive way. I typically drink after a workout (nothing is better after grinding than a cold beer) and I typically abstain the night before a workout. Sleep is up and down and recover takes a bit longer but I’m hitting 4 days a week on workouts and am mildly satisfied with the progress.

All this said, today was bench day and I’m a cpl beers deep.. was a good read. I’ll beat myself up tomorrow

 

[dawn16]

@frustrated pro tip. 2dl jack daniels mixed with 8dl coke zero is just 500kcal you'll have to remove and it will get you plastered. (does break erics rule of not consuming 15%+ kcal from alcohol do unless you eat like 3000kcal) on 2500 it'll run you 20%.

 

[frustrated]

@dawn16 Hahaha nice

 

[dawn16]

@frustrated

I love working out. And I love getting hammered

Lets be friends, i do exactly the same, i love farmer walk, deadlifts, squats, all heavy af and go get smashed. Maybe we are Rugby players spiritually.

 

[frustrated]

@dawn16 I like that - spiritual rugby players. Or Vikings. Fuck it.

Honing our skill strength and prowess to destroy small villages. Then drink all their beer.

 

[dawn16]

@frustrated Bruh im enjoying a Patagonia Pilsen Beer right now (00h28 here) and i trained at 22h pulled a 180kg deadlift.

Then drink all their beer.

COUNT ON ME

 

[frustrated]

@dawn16 Hahaha my man!!!!

Deadlift today for me too. Cracked 305 lbs on my 3rm (I’m a lightweight) .... and then the beer came out.

I have squats tomorrow so I’ll be going for the vodka!!

 

[frustrated]

@dawn16 My man. Hit 255 (lbs) on my 3rm max for squats today - not a personal record but I’m happy (I’m still tall and skinny). Didn’t eat at all before the workout. Doing an OMAD today... still hit 160g of protein though

Vodka is flowing. I’ve stolen their horses and am riding off w their women. Baseball is on, so I’m content

 

[michaela89]

@great_depression Dude your write-ups are amazing!
There's so much dogma that makes no sense (even in the medical field) about booze and sweeteners. Loved reading both of these.

 

[myredeemer3]

@great_depression The stuff about alcohol inhibiting REM sleep is interesting.... I usually don’t remember much, if any of my dreams, but drinking light to moderate amounts of alcohol tends to give me crazyyy vivid dreams all night

 

[dawn16]

@great_depression Thoughts on this?
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/30146330/

“found that the risk of all-cause mortality, and of cancers specifically, rises with increasing levels of consumption, and the level of consumption that minimises health loss is zero”

 

[aberli00]

@dawn16 Check this rebuttal out.

The problem is the study doesn't talk in absolute risk, but in terms of relative risk increase. When you look at it in absolute risk, it's not that scary. They later clarified:

Specifically, comparing no drinks with one drink a day the risk of developing one of the 23 alcohol-related health problems was 0.5% higher — meaning 914 in 100,000 15–95 year olds would develop a condition in one year if they did not drink, but 918 people in 100,000 who drank one alcoholic drink a day would develop an alcohol-related health problem in a year.

This increased to 7% in people who drank two drinks a day (for one year, 977 people in 100,000 who drank two alcoholic drinks a day would develop an alcohol-related health problem) and 37% in people who drank five drinks every day (for one year, 1252 people in 100,000 who drank five alcoholic drinks a day would develop an alcohol-related health problem).

 

[frankied1]

@dawn16 What you´re doing is like:

• Someone asks if smoking would make them unable to walk.
• Someone replies "No".
• Then you link studies that says "Smoking is one of the main cause of early deaths" and then ask on thoughts.

Although both statements are related to smoking, it isn´t the original topic of discussion.

 

[dawn16]

@frankied1 Their conclusion was the only amount of alcohol to have no negative effect was 0 or I mis interpreted the study conclusions, basically OP summary claimed you could
Drink daily with no downside if you track protein and calories, this seems to counter that or again I interpreted wrong?

If you’re getting a negative health effect you’re probably not maximizing “gains” ?

 

[great_depression]

@dawn16

OP summary claimed you could Drink daily with no downside

I suggest against this many times in the thread.

I would read the thread, not the summary. Also I would keep in mind that the research and thread is based around physique goals for intermediate/advanced bodybuilders and most of my information is backed by recommendations of the top natural bodybuilding coaches and their research as that is where I went for my recommendations.

I also put in many cons of drinking daily and the negative effects it can have on your physique goals.

 

[sanny11]

@great_depression Also, your 13g of alcohol which is described as "green" or acceptable, is very very low. Just a few sips of beer and you hit the "yellow" area....after a six pack you' ve got 1,5x the amount of the red flag area...

 

[frankied1]

@dawn16 I think you´ve misinterpreted the study conclusions.

The study conclusions isn´t about it having no negative effect in your entire body. Alcohol can damage your liver, your digestion system, etc. That´s like a "known fact".

OP only said that under a certain amount of alcohol it won´t affect your progress when it comes to getting muscles.