Genetics and "Ease" of Staying Lean

[kalboon]

@jlr1300 It probably also has to do with primary fuel type. A complex carb heavy diet has less diversity in the bio even when calories are the same.

 

[lovelivelaugh]

@jlr1300

The most likely reason probably has something to do with our gut microbiome. However, we still know so little about it that it is hard to say with conviction.

Can you explain this a bit more?

 

[jlr1300]

@lovelivelaugh https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/gut-bacteria-and-weight#section1

https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/do-gut-bacteria-inhibit-weight-loss

https://www.anl.gov/article/exploring-the-role-of-gut-bacteria-in-digestion

 

[lovelivelaugh]

@jlr1300 Thanks. Definitely interesting to think about.

 

[keitellf]

@lovelivelaugh Genetics bro

 

[craig01]

@lovelivelaugh Is there a group between 1 and 2? When i bulk, I can stay lean if I choose to, but I can also get really fat if I want (think, lots of spoonfuls of peanut butter and junk). I can recall times I've been lean and maintained it and times I've gotten really fat while trying to gain muscle. I can't recall only being in one group.

For example, I once did a lean bulk last year. Only ate in a surplus of about 300 to 500. I did gain strength and muscle while maintaining lean. However, I decided I just wanted to go faster, so I started eating upwards of 4000 calories a day. Strength went up a lot faster but so did fat, although I somehow only gained 15lbs in 4 months despite eating over my tdee by more than 1000 per day.

 

[lovelivelaugh]

@craig01 Yeah you're right. I think most people fall in between the two categories after reading everyone's replies.

Most people can get fat or stay sub 15% year round by just controlling calories and taking a slower approach to bulking and also being strict about not getting above 15%.

For some people it is easier to stay lean (i.e. their caloric requirements daily are much higher) and for some it is a lot harder (i.e. their caloric requirements daily are so low).

 

[rustyryan1979]

@lovelivelaugh It is the satiety that keeps us lean. I was always hungry until about a week ago... Something clicked, and feel full just after 300 cals. Huh... Still got the psychological need to chew something, but ye, something clicked

 

[dawn16]

@lovelivelaugh Category 1, bulking is hard for me and I just slow bulk for years at a time. My body feels better a low body fat, like 12%. I really worked hard this year to bulk up to 88kg and then when coronavirus hit I cut to about 81kg by stopping tracking food and just eating as much as I naturally wanted to

 

[vimalachristy]

@lovelivelaugh I found it super easy to stay lean as a teenager, but since turning 19, I got depressed and laid in bed all the time, ate a fuck ton and now I’ve been weightlifting and lost some fat but I’m still overweight and about 20-25% body fat when I used to be 10-15% body fat as a teen. I’m 21 now and I’m trying to lose fat but it’s a uphill climb.

 

[misteryman]

@lovelivelaugh FOLLOW UP: I've never seen a study that disagreed with the idea that genetics plays a huge role in your bodies decision to burn or store. What I've not seen is a consensus on ability to maintain a BFP. If the work is put in to reach a desired BFP, but you're naturally inclined to store fat are you doomed to gain if you're able to hold yourself to "maintenance calories"?

 

[lala1212]

@lovelivelaugh Genetics: Definitely a factor. All the men, and most of the women in my family on both sides are fat obese. I was one of them from about 12 years old until maybe 2016.

Somehow there was a big exception with my younger brother. He grew up to be 6" shorter than me, and naturally carries more muscle without training. He got to a 285lb back-squat at 155lbs body-weight for 5x5 in only a few months when he did decide to train. He also doesn't have much of an appetite, and has no problem saying "I don't really feel like eating the rest of this cake" -- which is a feeling I can't relate to. Whatever genetic mix he got allowed him to overcome any environmental factors.

Upbringing and environment can't be ignored for me though -- fast-food and buffets almost daily growing up, as well as pre-packaged snack foods being readily available constantly at home led to me getting very fat, very young. Having to completely re-program the types and amounts of food I eat, and my attitude towards foods over the years has been incredibly difficult but is making enough of a difference that I'm no longer in the overweight category with the rest of my family members. Definitely still a category "2" though.

 

[leslie82]

@lovelivelaugh My genes is pretty good at staying lean but ass at adding mass.

With little dietary effort I could probably have abs year round but only add maybe a lb or 2 of muscle.

 

[masonbrown]

@lovelivelaugh Its primarily attributed to people who believe in bulking.

Bulking is a huge waste of time and you probably gain just a few more pounds of muscle while sacrificing consistency.

 

[carriesatousa]

@masonbrown By "bulking" do you mean any caloric surplus at all is a waste of time? Or are you referring to a dirty bulk?

 

[masonbrown]

@carriesatousa Bulking as in any consistent caloric surplus. 90% of people just end up going on an endless bulk no matter how small their surplus is. Additionally, people always overshoot their intended goal. You are only supposed to bulk when you are sub 15% and the majority of people are not even there.

Maintaining your weight and depending on body recomposition is much a more mindful way of staying fit because you are force to eat right and train right.

More importantly the whole bulking/cutting strategy is most effective if you are taking PEDs. Naturals always gain more fat and lost more muscle when bulking and cutting respectively.

 

[carriesatousa]

@masonbrown You'll never get big only eating at maintenance though, that just sounds like a way to spin your wheels. Like someone who's 5' 11" and 160 lbs shouldn't just maintain forever unless they want to be small forever. Muscle loss during a cut is pretty minimal if protein and training are good, and it's not done at too fast of a pace relative to current body fat %.

 

[masonbrown]

@carriesatousa From my experience and observation of other naturals, how big you get is primarily based on your genetics and training stimulus. Eating has more effect on how much fat you put on rather than the muscle since the two processes are not mutually exclusive meaning losing fat does not mean you can't gain muscle and gaining fat does not mean you are gaining muscle. As long as there is enough nutrients to fuel muscle growth and there is a reason for it to grow (aka stimulus) you will build muscle. I've personally built muscle on a bulk, on maintenance and on a deficit. I really don't see any difference from my own experience. I think training stimulus and sleep is more important than anything else. You can be on a bulk start training half-ass with no muscle activation and you might as well not be training. You are just getting fat at the point.

As a natural with normal genetics you can probably gain as much as 3lbs-5lbs of lean muscle per year. If you are on a bulk, you might be able to gain 1-2 more lbs. I personally don't find that worth it to look like shit the rest of the year and have to spend more time losing the fat that you gained.

Also I just personally like staying lean year round. It's more predictable, feels better, I love looking at myself in the mirror and you can focus on just training harder since everything else stays the same. I could be wrong since I don't have the best genetics so people with better genetics could benefit from bulking, but body recomp definitely works for me.

 

[lordheretic]

@carriesatousa Muscle gains are trivially small on a week to week basis. Gaining a half pound of muscle a week is an incredible gain and only newbs will do that for their first year tops. That takes like 300 extra calories a day at most. You have people past that level going on 500+ calorie surpluses to bulk, no wonder most gym bro’s are fat.

 

[bryannahdawn]

@lovelivelaugh There may be some influence with genetics, but its mostly due to caloric intake. Depends on diets. Those who are lean stay lean because they don't eat as much as the non-lean ones.