@ilovebilliejoearmstrong I tell my clients this all the time. "Everything works, but good training works quicker"
There's a guy at my gym with terrible form on damn near every exercise that has completely blown up in the last two years simply because although good form is important it's not like you won't grow with bad form.
@joaa I mean a consistent shitty work out over time (in this case repetitive bad form) is still better than trying to do a perfect workout once in a blue moon.
Other than injury risk, consistent people who may not know a lot, will still be rewarded with gains to an extent.
@ilovebilliejoearmstrong This is 100% it, and the same thing goes for sooo many other popular training facts. Rep ranges, rest times, exercise variations... Influencers ofc don't want to be wrong because comment sections will eat them alive so they just promote what the latest studies say. But just because X amount of protein had measurably better results than X-10 amount, doesn't mean that's what everyone needs to do. Unless the X-10 group is making no progress. But protein is expensive and eating all day is difficult and 80% of optimal results is fantastic for everyone that isn't trying to compete.
@chickaboom Agree. I am sure there is some science that can back some of these claims for optimal anything, but at the end of the day just exercise! Eat foods that will help you reach your goals. People overthink a lot of things that end up hindering them.
@chickaboom It's ridiculous how long some of these "optimal" rest times are getting. People are taking 3-5 minutes rest between a set of triceps extensions. The exact opposite of what all the biggest dudes in history have done lol.
@dawn16 Yup. 3 to 5 minutes between sets is provably optimal for hypertrophy... but that's for a single exercise. When you account for the necessary volume for every muscle group, it's just not practical. I have no idea why people are actually doing this in the gym when, as you pointed out, many of the greatest physiques in history were built before anyone thought to rest that much.
@ilovebilliejoearmstrong Totally agree. I have big skepticism around following a lot of studies. The thing is it can point you in the direction but you have to come to your own conclusions.
@bronsontaur Studies show averages. There are always outliers - individualization matters. Use studies as a starting point but don’t be afraid to experiment to figure out what works best for you.
@newmommie305 Sounds like it. Data skepticism is almost as bad as data obsession. We all know that some of these studies have some funding from sources with a proprietary interest in an outcome, but there’s really no way around that currently. If they’ve been peer reviewed and published, that’s really as good as it’s going to get.
@laveencw Im super skeptical about data in excersize science because there tends to be a shitload of confounding factors with every study i see. Its very hard to control for everything.
For example. The literature says that 10 to 20 to FAILURE sets are optimal per muscle group per week. But the fact is that these people are going to volitional failure. The scientists dont have a gun to their head making them grind reps. So of course 20 sets is better when every set is rpe 6.
I on the other hand smash myself to pieces and do rest pause. I get like 3 sets a week per muscle group per week on dc training and am making great gains.
Like i said earlier in the thread im just skeptical not rejecting of science. I just think that you need to do your own n=1 study on yourself.
@bronsontaur Also, it your trying to eat 180g a day vs 90g a day, your probably going to do a shake first thing in the morning, and at night, and after the workout in addition to higher protein meals. That mean you have protein going in more often which I think is better than 2 huge meals a day.
@rd0845336 Protein timing really does not matter for the vast majority of people. Daily intake and maintaining a positive nitrogen balance is what is important.
@rd0845336 There’s a lot of literature on it, but the TLDR is that if you are in a positive nitrogen balance in a given interval, you are anabolic, and if you are in a negative nitrogen balance, you are catabolic. The goal being, overall maintaining a net positive nitrogen balance regardless of whether you are bulking or cutting, to build or preserve muscle, respectively
@ilovebilliejoearmstrong Also absorption of protein is extremely important. If your gut isn’t healthy it doesn’t matter how much protein you eat, you’ll end up shitting out a huge chunk of it. Someone who eats 70g of protein a day could get more protein than someone who eats 150g based on the health of their system. If you aren’t pairing protein with the right foods/ gut health regimen you probably aren’t getting all the protein you need. Gotta get that fiber.
@seakingjesus Agree. However i did my research on this topic (few years ago so can't provide any sources). The studies said, that bodybuilders/ stron man/ lifters in general (not endurance athletes!) have huge demand for protein and it is wasted on very rare occasion. 2.0-2.5 was absorbed. For elite bodybuilers absorption was up to 4.5g/ 1kg bodyweight/ day.
Unfortunately nothing was said about gut health/ bacteria.
@supersr There has been a recent flux in gut health data, most of which is based on patients with GI track issues which are preventing them from processing food. Bodybuilders / strong man competitors have been working out and eating for a long time at that demand and their system gets accustomed to it. My advice is more for people who have digestive issues who are just getting into working out. If you already have a healthy system, protein absorption is much higher.
When I started working out I was getting off some pretty rough patch after being cut by a rusty piece of metal on the job. My system got trashed from antibiotics and my gut was a mess. If I had just started out eating by eating 2g protein/lb I would have just been burning money. Instead I made sure to bump up the fermented foods, fiber, prebiotic/probiotic food and other gut health promoters alongside my protein intake to boost overall absorption. By the time my gut was healthy again I was back to 1.5-2g/lb with no gut issues.
