@petr0s You’ll lose some muscle mass but you really need to lose a lot of fat before the competition if you’re planning on dropping 30 lbs in 4 months.
It’s entirely possible (likely) that he will adjust the plan as time goes on. May I ask why even get a coach if you are going to push back against what they are designing for you?
I have a little experience coaching for people who are close to me and when they resist what I’m telling them (backed by science and for each of them I will put together a plan and link around 20 studies supporting various decisions) based on their own notions then it becomes quite a frustrating experience. Not only are they unhappy with the result (that’s what you get when you don’t follow the plan???) but I become disillusioned with being their coach. You didn’t hire him to force you to eat and work out a certain way. You hired him to guide you and motivate you. So either take the guidance or do t have a coach
@godseb Well I hired him for the exercise aspect moreso than the nutrition, but I’m also new to BB as a whole. I’m asking on the forum because I know there are a lot of shitty coaches out there, and I’d rather ask than fail. If he’s right, I WANT to follow his guidance. I just dont know because it goes against my whole college degree.
@petr0s What does your degree suggest? As far as I’ve seen, research supports deficits up to 700 calories per day without additional muscle loss when compared to 100 calories per day. Beyond that you will be losing more muscle but also losing weight in general faster.
@godseb Usually 1g per lb of body weight/ 2g per kg has been shown to maintain muscle mass. Additionally, a 20% deficit is the furthest you can go without risking negative health effect and muscle loss. Once again though, I know the sport isn’t healthy and I want to do what will be most optimal to succeed in my goals.
@petr0s 1g/lb has been debunked to a certain extent. Current research shows that beyond .7g/lb will have minimal or no effect. And holding a 30% deficit for a few months wont cause any sort of significant problems either. Only when held long term is a deficit like that a problem
@petr0s As a competitor and a coach, I think that’s way too aggressive. Really you want to be ready early and don’t want to keep dieting into a show. So you actually only have 13-14 weeks instead of 16 weeks. You are running the risk of losing muscle by being that aggressive. I would go slower with the weight loss and plan on a show early next year.
@petr0s Realistically if you’re in figure at 5’10” shredded you’ll likely be on stage closer to 140 unless you have a very advanced physique in terms of muscularity or a larger structure. Stage lean is different than walk around lean especially in Figure and since you’re new to this I’m guessing on the lighter side of things like 140ish maybe even high 130’s if you really nail conditioning. My wife is pretty muscular and 132-134 on stage in pro Bikini at 5’10” with a medium structure as a reference guideline.
So you’re trying to lose 35lbs in 16weeks and show up 100% on show day while doing so and you’re worried that 1500 calories isn’t healthy or realistic? I got some unfortunate news for you, losing 35lbs in 16 weeks is not healthy or realistic. There is simply no way of accomplishing your goal and showing up 100% on show day without some pretty extreme methods. You chose an ambitious goal and suffering to reach it is in your future should you stick with it. That’s just the reality of the situation and no 1500 calories is not low considering the extreme goal you’ve set.
Also as a helpful tip I would drop all association of your education in regards to prep. What we do isn’t studied or taught in schools and goes against pretty much everything someone would learn when studying nutrition in college. Generally speaking the best coaches in the world have very little nutrition education and just a ton of experience, great pattern recognition and a good eye. What we do is extreme physique sports taking the body to its limits and it is not healthy to do so.
Sorry to break this hard truth to you but to me it looks like you needed to hear the hard reality to set yourself up right mentally of what you’re walking in to these next 16 weeks. I don’t prep Figure any longer but did for years, it’s tough so get ready.
@buzzard3 I’m aware it’s brutal and unhealthy! I wouldn’t do it if I didn’t know the risks beforehand. I would say I do have a larger structure (especially upper body/shoulders, hence figure lol). I can have all the information in the world about losing weight and gaining muscle for normal circumstances, I just wasn’t sure of the norm for more hardcore categories of BB. I’m just new to the sport, and my trainer hasn’t previously done figure. He’s very qualified in the sense that he’s a professional bodybuilder and has been a PT for bikini and the regular population for about 30 years, but with the lack of experience with figure I just wanted to make sure. Thank you for the reassurance that he’s correct.
@petr0s I don’t prep figure but if you came to me with that goal I’d say pick a later show if I’m being honest. The odds of you showing up 100% after huge transformation are really low because it’s not just a weight loss thing it’s about how you look which is very different. You may hit your target weight which even that is unlikely but then your body will not pop and look drained going through such a beating to get there, really you need to lose the 40ish pounds then 2ish additional weeks to let your body recover, fill out, reduce inflammation, not rebound with water from carbs etc.. to be 100%. It’s not as easy as just losing weight and you’re ready to step on stage.
@petr0s I'm sorry but you might need to check your math.
You want to be 145 pounds in 16 weeks. You are 175lb now. Given your lack of experience its highly likely your true stage weight will be 140, as this is figure and not bikini and you will need to be harder than you probably think, and everyone always underestimates how much fat they need to lose.
This is 1.8lbs a week lost even using your original estimate, and assuming weight loss could be linear... This is a ~1000 calorie a day deficit even using the most optimistic calculation. You are absolutely cooked if you think you're going to be able to hit what you need by staying much above 1500 as a small woman. It's true that your metablism will slow down and you will lose your period. However, you will literally not be in stage condition without it. It is likely that in the last weeks you will be below 1000, however, this is just the reality of starting show prep 30 pounds overweight.
You have extreme goals with extreme timelines and this requires an extreme stimulus.
My advice to reassure you:
Do not do the show, run a cutting phase until you are much leaner and only need to lose 10-15, then consider that to be the baseline starting point for a prep. Do a different show at least 26 weeks from now.
Run the deficit as instructed for 4 weeks. See if you are losing the weight at the rate you need. if its coming off too fast, talk to coach again, and if they wont budge, take over yourself or message me for further guidance.
@petr0s I would cease looking to this person for nutritional advice and start looking for a other coach - at least for diet/nutrition
Questions;
Personal experience: has the coach competed in natural bodybuilding competitions? How long ago? What were their results?
How many other natural bodybuilders has this person advised? Are they willing to provide references? What do these references say about their experience working with this coach?
What tools does the coach provide to the table? Are they familiar with common problems challenges and mistakes in dieting for competition? Do they know how to help you monitor and make adjustments?
@petr0s The whole bodybuilding coaching thing is a joke. The only time you need a prep coach is if you are a pro or need help peaking last 2 weeks. All else is just a numbers game, everyone is “educated” on their own so all you can do is just trust them. Everyone who is experienced can coach themselves.
All coaches do is drop calories a bit depending on how fast you’re losing weight, most of which will be carbs, protein stays fixed and fat gets lowered ocasionally so you can keeps extra carbs. Cardio is always LISS, starting off easy and ramping it up progressively, there is a fine balance with cardio amount and calorie intake that has to be met. Essentially you always increase cardio first (to a certain point) before you lower calories so your body gets more nutrients/energy at all times. Strenght training is dependant on you and is the easiest part. Thats it
