@beloved89 thank you 
I don't understand S&S strength standards
- Thread starter khohanguc
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juancarlos
New member
@khohanguc By tradition of sorts, the milestone weights with kettlebells are the 32 and the 48. Mainly, I think, because the 32 is the heaviest of the "normals" and then the 48 is the heaviest of the heavy (even though you can buy even heavier bells, up to 92 kg).
It's not a fair standard, nor is it an actual standard. The names are because somebody said "it's simple and sinister" and Pavel liked it and used it. Things need names and sometimes the names make us think there's something more there. If the 32 was called "Red" and the 48 "Blue", you'd feel differently about them.
Nobody here should be judging anybody based on whether they've reached Simple or Sinister. But if you get Simple done at 63 kg BW, good job! Bodyweight definitely matters. One sort of a standard is pressing half your bodyweight, so BW is definitely not ignored in everywhere.
It's not a fair standard, nor is it an actual standard. The names are because somebody said "it's simple and sinister" and Pavel liked it and used it. Things need names and sometimes the names make us think there's something more there. If the 32 was called "Red" and the 48 "Blue", you'd feel differently about them.
Nobody here should be judging anybody based on whether they've reached Simple or Sinister. But if you get Simple done at 63 kg BW, good job! Bodyweight definitely matters. One sort of a standard is pressing half your bodyweight, so BW is definitely not ignored in everywhere.
@khohanguc Exercise with a weight that suits you. Where is the problem? Wounded self-esteem? No one cares what weight you exercise with. Consistency is important, not weight. Consistency builds volume in the long run and only volume will bring results. Everything else is a guarantee of injury.
By the way, swings are mainly about core stability and technique. It comes with volume. Better contraction of muscle fibers, better connection of muscle with the brain.
By the way, swings are mainly about core stability and technique. It comes with volume. Better contraction of muscle fibers, better connection of muscle with the brain.
@khohanguc 2 words for you buddy... Progressive overload. You are doing awesome! Keep up the good work
@nmuhammad thanks my friend
@khohanguc At 41 years with really no strength training background I started my s&s journey with the 16kg, eventually the 24, hitting timeless simple with the 32, then finally the timed simple. Took about a year. Started working my way towards sinister (about 6 weeks) with the 40kg before throwing in the towel. Developed tendinitis in my elbow from swinging that ungodly massive bell with one hand, and the get ups were pretty damn scary. I never really felt safe with the 40kg bell above my face. But I'd say all in all the progression was worth it. Taught me how to stick to a daily exercise program for an extended period of time. And I did get much stronger and shed quite a bit of body fat in the process. Afterwards I ran ROP twice in a row with 20kg, and 24kg. Just finished 5 weeks of dry fighting weight with double 20s, and it felt too easy, so will probably go again with double 24s. I wouldn't worry too much about how much weight or standards, listen to your body and push yourself while also being safe.
@ruthgrace Congrats for hitting simple. I'm scared to death of tendonitis, I'm rehabing a golfer's elbow right now and I feel like TGUs are helping me heal ? 
Hope I'm right.
RTO sounds like a good idea for the next step once I'm finished with S&S.
Thanks for the encouragement
Hope I'm right.RTO sounds like a good idea for the next step once I'm finished with S&S.
Thanks for the encouragement
@khohanguc I am a little bit taller 1,8 m but nearly the same weight as you and I work out with 24 KG and I am in my 40s now. I think you can do it. Just stay on track. But I must admit, I studied sports and have a background as an athlet and a lifter (a not very good though). I use S & S to do the work: 100 Swings, 10 Getups daily. Feels much better than doing nothing. Just take your time and add weight constantly as recommended in S&S. One of my clients 10 Years ago told me his secret to success - stolen from nike 
Just do it! Don't overthink: Get your work done and enjoy your life If the numbers don't fit for you, think about them as goals and goals work good if they are not too easy or too hard, so just make some up for yourself. Still I think 32 is doable once you spend some time with 24.
Just do it! Don't overthink: Get your work done and enjoy your life If the numbers don't fit for you, think about them as goals and goals work good if they are not too easy or too hard, so just make some up for yourself. Still I think 32 is doable once you spend some time with 24.
@khohanguc You're absolutely right, we all have the equivalent of the 'body weight card' but play it wisely, there's always a tiny child somewhere warming up with your newest pb.
You want to hit his simple standard, you have to hit 32, he decided. 24 is still great, but that isn't the standard
You want to hit his simple standard, you have to hit 32, he decided. 24 is still great, but that isn't the standard
@kruise Great for the tiny child, honestly happy for him.
What I'm arguing is the standard doesn't mean anything if it's arbitrary. Even powerlifting has weight classes for a reason. Someone who is 190cm/6'3 & 100kg/220lbs will have an easier time hitting the simple standard than me at 170cm/5'7 & 63kg/138lb. Pretty obvious.
The standards should be in % of bodyweight not an absolute metric that doesn't apply the same to everyone.
What I'm arguing is the standard doesn't mean anything if it's arbitrary. Even powerlifting has weight classes for a reason. Someone who is 190cm/6'3 & 100kg/220lbs will have an easier time hitting the simple standard than me at 170cm/5'7 & 63kg/138lb. Pretty obvious.
The standards should be in % of bodyweight not an absolute metric that doesn't apply the same to everyone.
monstershouter
New member
@khohanguc `You answered your own question:
- the standard doesn’t mean anything
- it’s completely arbitrary
@khohanguc If it makes you feel better I’m a taller / heavier athlete and have similar thoughts around calisthenics. 10 pull ups for me is a very different amount of weight moved than it is for a lighter athlete.
As long as we are all training hard and setting realistic goals for ourselves, we’re doing just fine.
As long as we are all training hard and setting realistic goals for ourselves, we’re doing just fine.
loves2readya
New member
@khohanguc that should tell you all you need to know about S&S. its a book centered around 2 arbitrary movements. its nothing.
@loves2readya You know what you''re probably right. It a nice complement to my calisthenics routine tho so I'll keep at it until I hit the routine with 24kg. My personal goal and standard for myself. Then I'll try to find a more advanced program maybe. Thanks
loves2readya
New member
@khohanguc if you want to pursue actual benchmarks (with kettlebells) proven over years and years with thousands of competitors with weight classes and age categories you'll need to venture over to girevoy sport.
@loves2readya My main sport is wrestling and I find that hardstyle helps me best for developing athleticism in that. I respect girovoy but it's not the right tool for me right now. Maybe later down the road, I'll keep that in mind anyway. Thanks
edit:typo
edit:typo
loves2readya
New member
@khohanguc retired wrestler myself. 44. trained HS for years before GS. trained HS longer than ive trained GS. started off as an RKC. drank all the kool-aid. i can assure you, the athleticism tied to HS is marketing. best of luck on your journey.
@loves2readya man you did drop a bomb on me. I'm for sure going to research this subject. Thanks a lot