Genetics aren’t what you think they are

[junior59]

@nbj486 This seems like a strawman to me. Genetics do come up regularly but I think it's rare to see the defeatist person who thinks they cannot make any progress because their genetics suck.

Not acknowledging genetics (which I know isn't what you're saying, nonetheless others may read it that way) is also too reductionist.
Anecdote- I have pretty good genetics for distance running and while I trained hard when I ran, I also needed a certain baseline of genetics to be able to achieve the results I got.
Good running genetics and good bodybuilding genetics are somewhat inversely correlated and as such I've spent the better part of 15 or so years lifting with decent but modest results. I.e. If you saw me you'd know I likely lifted but are by no means blown away. Someone with good bodybuilding genetics could achieve similar results in 2 years of solid training.

At the end of the day, not something you can change so mostly a "boohoo" and move on, but I think it's very fair to acknowledge it periodically as the elephant in the room, especially when people are talking about following specific influencer programs and similar.

 

[valula]

@junior59 yeah, especially since we have that issue that our standards are like crazy, before social media you was a beast if you had a six back and where toned, nowadays you are a "stick"

For example, look how boomer say that an ronaldo or Ibrahimovic is massive, for our bodybuilding standards they are nothing, so our baseline is like the top of the best genetics and not the avg, since the avg wouldnt gaim traction in social media, not even close

 

[junior59]

@valula yeah very true. Or like Toby Maguire Spiderman or Brad Pitt in Fight Club as "jacked". By tody's standards, they are *tiny*. Perception has changed a ton in even just the last decade or so

 

[bioluminescence]

@nbj486 16 year old Lee priest has entered the chat

 

[mike331]

@nbj486 I believe in about five (not all equal) primary factors when it comes to your physique.

• Diet
• Workout Routine
• Supplementation (including "Super" Supplementation)
• Rest
• Genetics

Genetics plays a role, but it's merely a piece of the greater puzzle and not the be all and end all.

 

[nbj486]

@mike331 Yeah I never said they didn’t play a role, but it’s just not as cut and dry as “good genes” and “bad genes”. The human body is complex and boiling it all down to genetics is reductive.

 

[godjerry]

@nbj486 genetics are the single most important thing for bodybuilding becuase u cant control it while u can always learn to train or diet better. Genetics can give you advantages such as

more testosterone and free testosterone

more igf1 or hgh in general

lower myoststin(i think thats a thing determined by genes)

bone size and density(which dictate how big and strong ur muscle is and how big it can get

proportions (such as 1:1 arm to forearm which is very important or wide clavicles and upper torso to narrow waist and hips which is bones u cant lose fat if u dont have fat there)

muscular head insertions (determines how your muscles will look developed u cant fill a chest gap u cant fix a split biceps where the difference in the 2 heads is so big and the long head is so short and peaky it pops out and u can clearly see the 2 different heads which is disgusting, or your lats are high up inserted near your pecs and you can't have a full back) and the insertion also dictates how strong, endurant(short and thin insertions are always inferior in terms of endurance how many reps you can do before u get tired to long and wide insertions)

muscle tendon insertions which also will either make you stronger when inserted further from the insertion origin example biceps is way stronger if its inserted further down the forearm it has to do with biomechanical leverages. the pecs also are stronger when inserted further down the shoulder/arm and it also helps a lot if u have wide clavicles then youre ideal for pressing movements.

muscle fiber make up ratio of slow twitch muscle fibers to fast twitch muscle fibers.

theres also a ton of other genetic mutations or normal genes present in some absent in others which help with metabolic processes or help your body digest and absorb nutrients more effectively and so on.

 

[star440]

@godjerry Almost all of those things except proportions and bone size and insertion sites are more likely to be influenced to a much greater extent by mechanisms that aren’t genetic.

Sleep well, eat well, don’t stress, train right, train consistently, and start training early. Those are 80% of it.

 

[godjerry]

@star440 true that but then theres people who dont sleep do drugs and such live off of cigarettes and s progress. but ure also saying "except proportions bone size and insertion sites" which are cruical for aesthethics and strength" the reason im actually learning scientific optimal training is because my proportions suck every single muscle insertion on me sucks except for my calf and before i started training my arms were sticks and even now after 2 years my bones on my arms are still thin and if i want to put on any size or look a little better i have to train optimally. then theres people with opposite of what i have and also high test levels who can get away with spamming high reps and eating in a caloric deficit and still gain more muscle. people should be more aware of genetics and their importance to bodybuilding

 

[allysolkins]

@nbj486 I've seen a lot of new people saying "will I make it? My genetics are bad" and they've not even been in the gym for 6 months?!? It's fucking killing me

The only thing I can think of is that it's down to tik tok influencers poisoning their minds before they've even started, dumb fucks on there with zero education claiming to be PT's....

 

[nbj486]

@allysolkins I feel like it’s this sentiment that I’m responding too the most

 

[jody]

@nbj486 Genetics are very evident when you look at strength and conditioning sports, but it shouldn't be a discouraging factor for someone because they can't change it. However, you have to be an idiot if you think genetics are not what determine everything about your looks.

 

[drgary777]

@nbj486 I do look like X influencer, and just like X influencer I will not be a professional bodybuilder. Genetics do determine whether or not you will be successful in the competitive sport of bodybuilding, you cannot change your insertions.

For the vast majority of people I'd say the most important and never talked about genetics to simply look good and not compete, are skin elasticity and how even your bodyfat distribution is. If you look at most natural influencers this is almost always on display. Perfectly even bodyfat distribution despite not being incredibly lean year round, and tight skin even if they were overweight in the past.

That being said, most people do everything wrong, and don't understand just the extreme amount of work it does take to get a respectable physique. It's just you can have all the muscle in the world and if your insertions are junk and you have a stomach flap at 12% BF you're not looking like what most people are striving for.

 

[lybrah]

@nbj486 I don’t know, I definitely put on muscle at a faster pace than other people I knew, even just in football offseason. I really do think genes play a larger role than what most people would like to believe. I see guys that I knew in high school at the gym and some still look the exact same for the most part. You can say it’s because they eat and sleep like shit, but I can say I was able to add mass with a very shitty sleep schedule and bullshit diet.

Everyone should lift and really apply themselves regardless, but some people are absolutely predetermined to be more jacked than others in the same way some people are taller than others.

 

[giamfreeg]

@nbj486 Blaming genetics for the limit on amount of muscle mass that’s possible to gain is different to blaming genetics for how aesthetically pleasing that muscle will look on your body. Some people get huge and look like absolute shit (not naming any names but there are a bunch of 250lb+ lean bodybuilders that look terrible) no amount more or balancing out of muscle will fix bad insertions.

 

[yourclosechurch]

@nbj486 And girls think they will become massive if they do 2 bicep curls.

 

[radiosgalore]

@nbj486 I’ve only seen fit people make this argument.

 

[wwjosh19]

@nbj486 Fragile people will get upset when you tell them they have good genetics because they think you’re taking away from the work they put in to get where they are.

Stable people say thank you, that’s the only difference I’ve noticed.

 

[cindy32770]

@nbj486 I agree, Jamaicans dominate sprinting events but 54% of Jamaicans are overweight or obese. Clearly, genetics play an effect, but you have to actually train.

It reminds me of people who believe that any person who has a decently muscular physique must be enhanced. If people actually trained consistently for 5-10 years, they’d realise what’s possible.

For me personally, I was born with long bicep insertions and I looked like I had some biceps before I even started lifting weights. After years of lifting consistently, I built up to curling 60kg with an EZ bar, and I’m working towards curling 70kg. Yet, there will be people who are still curling 15kg each arm complaining about their low bicep insertions.

I actually have suboptimal chest genetics as one of my lower pecs doesn’t fill in quite like the other one. My response to this has been to add another push day every week to do what I can with the body that I have.

 

[supersr]

@nbj486 Genetic is a thing and you simply deny science. That is absolutely not a justification for being lazy or failing diet, but you can't deny that 1 has better conditions to have good body than the other., just like small frame 5'5 140lbs dude will never be a strongmen like 6'5 300lbs dude.