Novice strength levels - 0-1 rep a week even in calorie surplus, high protein, good sleep

[sweetpants]

@cybernetic If your diet and sleep is on point, it's likely to be your programming. That is what you are failing to precisely describe here.

Honestly, even if your diet and sleep were shitty, even with "bad form" too, I'd expect a person to bench more than 22kg after 8 years. I'd wager it's your programming.

 

[cybernetic]

@sweetpants Completely agree. Like with my friend, he goes off of like 4 hours of sleep a night, doesn’t track protein, doesn’t track calories, just goes into the gym and lifts every set to failure and in a year he’s to infinity and beyond levels above me in strength.

 

[carolinar7]

@cybernetic

Wanna know what he’s doing differently? He’s not tracking his calories, he’s not tracking his protein, he’s not doing RPE, he’s not got perfect form. he’s just going in and lifting maximally every workout without much else.

Sounds like your buddy is working hard and putting in actual effort while you’re busy majoring in the minors and getting in your own way. There’s a lesson to be learned there.

You can get really good results doing everything as wrong as you possibly can as long as you also do it as hard and consistently as you possibly can.

 

[theadmiral]

@cybernetic

No, I’m suggesting I want to build the most size as possible so I’m doing hypertrophy training and increasing volume week to week.

Has increasing volume without getting stronger led you to any gain in size? Are you happy with your progress?

he’s not doing RPE, he’s not got perfect form. he’s just going in and lifting maximally every workout without much else.

He also seems to be increasing the weight rather than the volume? Seeing as he's actually lifting more now than he used to?

It sounds like he's training very differently to you considering the fact he's supposedly running the same program

It just seems wild that you've spent 8 years training to lift 44kg, are unhappy with that fact, have literal proof in front of you as to what works and what doesn’t, yet still somehow think that you're doing the right thing

 

[cybernetic]

@theadmiral I just want to note that I increase volume and weight, I’m not doing like 300 reps on 22kg lol.

Terribly unhappy. The previous month I was gaining strength very fast but it was all just muscle memory, now I’m back to the shit semi-plateaued state.

The only thing he’s doing and I’m not doing is tracking calories, protein, and lifting maximally. Do I toss RPE out the window and start lifting maximally?

I would be daft to ask for help and claim to be doing EVERYTHING right. I’m saying I’m doing all the “by the book” stuff and seeing terrible gains. I’m only mentioning the stuff I’m doing “right” to avoid wasting people’s time with noob advice like “eat more protein”.

 

[niagaraboy]

@cybernetic Are you sure you are accurately estimating your RPE? Have you ever failed a rep? The trouble for RPE for early beginners is they often underestimate themselves.

 

[bcity]

@cybernetic

Do I toss RPE out the window and start lifting maximally?

Yes. Please do this. Take every set to absolute muscular failure. That way you'll actually know what it feels like to fail and can properly gauge your RPE in the future.

EDIT: To add to this. When I say muscular failure, I mean get pinned by your bench, get stuck in the hole on squats, have your deadlifts literally be stapled to the ground, etc. None of this technical failure bullshit. You're not moving enough weight to get hurt so just send it.

 

[thebreakdown]

@cybernetic

I’m saying I’m doing all the “by the book” stuff and seeing terrible gains.

By which book? Are you making things up for yourself or following programming designed by experts?

The stronger by science Hypertrophy Template is an affordable program that has a great reputation because it’s designed to adjust based on your performance. It’s designed by experts.

 

[rh27]

@cybernetic You should probably worry less about perfect form and RPE if your body is having better results on the same program but just trying harder instead of focusing on those things

 

[bcity]

@cybernetic Sounds like he's figured out the key is to put in some effort instead of trying to be perfect. You should follow his lead!

 

[holycrow]

@cybernetic

He’s not tracking his calories, he’s not tracking his protein, he’s not doing RPE, he’s not got perfect form. he’s just going in and lifting maximally every workout without much else.

Omg same.

 

[cybernetic]

@holycrow If it works it works lol

 

[holycrow]

@cybernetic It works because it ensures that you actually put in effort. Have you gotten any advice here that you're gonna implement? I would suggest running a free beginner program from the r/fitness wiki and just follow that for a while. Maybe try gzclp. It has amrap sets, which will probably teach you what true failure is. I would highly recommend it.

 

[religionofevolution]

@cybernetic From reading some of your posts i left out what you already do.

1. Creatine
2. Try changing to barbell benching
3. 5x5 prorgamms
4. Pre workout
5. Dont train on empty or full stomach
6. Try something like super agressive music
7. No fap might help
8. Try to not mentally exhaust yourself before hitting the gym
9. Get a spotter so you cam safely push yourself
10. Train more often. There were studies that even dividing your push days and doing benching on more days helped.
11. Dont stretch before training but afterwards
12. Protein shakes if you didnt start yet
13. Get test levels and other things like Vit D and b12 checked
14. Balanced diet
15. Get light in the morning
16. Do a warmup set way below your working set
17. Train bench first on chest days
18. Incremental weight increases like 1,25 kg
19. No alcohol, no smoking, no drugs
20. Consistency

 

[getty2010]

@religionofevolution

7 no fap might help

Well yeah, benching one-handed isn't the best way to do it.

But any other time, sure, go at it.

 

[noodlesnoodlesnoodles]

@cybernetic I would guess there is a technique issue here or if you have particularly long levers that could account for the difference (or any shoulder injuries)?

What are your other lifts like for example if you ohp is the same and your bench then you definitely have a technique problem as you should always be able to bench more than ohp (simply because your bench has more chest involvement).

Perhaps try machine presses if they are way higher then it is your technique and you may need to start again.

With Dumbell press the problem can be getting them into position so you can press way more you just can’t get them into position?

 

[johnlxyz]

@noodlesnoodlesnoodles I think the opposite is true, no technique is going to be bad enough to explain this result.

It's insufficient volume imo, with slight chance of too much volume (don't think he listed his volume anywhere).

Sounds like calories are not the problem because he has gained weight before and sounds like he has enough will to progress that low RPE is not the problem either.

 

[weepingwillow422]

@cybernetic Try introducing rest-pause sets or playing with your rep ranges.

You may also find pyramid sets helpful in troubleshooting (or necessary for progress—though, they're slightly less good than straight sets for the average lifter)

When you bulk, bulk super slowly. When you cut, cut quickly.

 

[cybernetic]

Here’s my current self made program: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1TgL-59n_FjPE8v5nlYKIYxZx-Eb92Vrbo-N7p3IEZBA/edit?usp=sharing

I’m on week 2 right now.

 

[jayb05]

@cybernetic Honestly there are so many questions that I don't know where to start. The rep and weight numbers are all over the place. You maybe have been lifting 8 years, but not training. Scrap everything, don't try programing for yourself. Take whatever beginner program you see/like, and just add reps/weight every week and forget about RPE for half a year at least.

Also hire a coach or at least post a form check.