Today would’ve marked the start of a 15 week prep. Here’s the result of 6 weeks of cleaning up the bulk in anticipation of this contest prep

[smash89]

Progress Picture

I am 22 y/o, 6’7 and currently 254lbs.
I’ve been training for 4 years, 3 of which I was vegan. I introduced meat to my diet last April. This would’ve been my third show to date.

As for diet I’m currently eating a 330P/220C/90F macro split. Brought down the bulk calories from 5k+ to around 3400. I supplement protein, glutamine, creatine, L-Leucine and EAAs.

I train 6 days out of 8. Current split is Chest-Arms-Quads+Calves-Rest-Back-Shoulders-Hams+Glutes-Rest repeat. I do 20 mins of post workout cardio every workout day and walk 4km with the doggo most days.

Anyone else had their show cancelled on them? I’m not mad but it’s fun to have a finish line when cutting. Stay safe natty nation!

 

[niecey85]

@smash89 You train each muscle once every 8 days? Gee. What's the rationale?

 

[ardyan]

@niecey85 That stood out to me too tbh. Should be hitting every muscle group twice per week to ensure maximum muscle protein synthesis etc but each to their own

 

[dawn16]

@ardyan Especially as a natty lifter

 

[kens]

@ardyan Go tell that to the immense majority of successful natty bodybuilders who get their best results by running "bro"splits.

 

[smash89]

@niecey85 I hit it fucking hard and heavy. I’ll also do some recall exercises for added frequency. Chest during shoulders, tris during chest, bis during back, quads during hams and hams during quads etc. You get the point.

 

[niecey85]

@smash89 Bruh I hate to be the bearer of bad news but:

• https://mennohenselmans.com/maximum-productive-training-volume-per-session/
• https://weightology.net/the-members...uscle-size-the-ultimate-evidence-based-bible/
• https://weightology.net/the-members...ncy-for-hypertrophy-the-evidence-based-bible/
• https://www.strongerbyscience.com/muscle-damage/
• https://renaissanceperiodization.com/hypertrophy-training-guide-central-hub/

 

[servant232]

@niecey85 "Bearer of bad news"

hahahah, this is pinnacle of... sorry but I have to say it, stupidity, I have red on this subreddit (or on reddit) in a while.

This is how I read your comments:

"Sorry that you found system that works for you and that in 4 years produced decent results for you. See, in this 6 links I will provide argument why you dont train optimally and why you should change completely your style of training in order to align with the newest sciences findings and conclusions.

You trained like a casual on r/fitness but if you read these studies you will get an edge on everybody else cause you are gonna train actually on optimal phase."

I barfed on how idiotic this comment is and frankly, seeing 30 upvotes makes it even more hilarious.

" I'm saying you're having slower progress"

COMPARED TO WHO?!??! what defines slower progress? Please science man, explain to me, where does conclusion of him making slower progress comes from?

Even gurus that you listen so religiously say: In the end, it DOESNT REALLY MATTER. It all comes down to an individual and individual approach can make the not optimal training optimal and vice versa.

This cultist approach to science is just astonishingly hilarious to read and peoples incapability to realize that ALOT of things worked, work and will keep working in future.

 

[great_depression]

@servant232 What you are seeing are evidence-based recommendations. Not people linking studies. There is a big difference and here's what the differences are.

 

[servant232]

@great_depression If an individual doesnt want evidence - based recommendations and has been trianing for almost 5 years on his own terms which he considers to be optimal, and that 5 years of training experienced PROVIDED HIM WITH A DECENT RESULTS, why in the hell would you enforce evidence-based training on him?

What would that accomplish? More results? are you sure about that?

First point of tldr of the article says: a) " Learn to recognize and keep yourself away from the traps of black and white thinking in regards to training. "

Put a fucking period right there cause there is nothing else to add.

 

[great_depression]

@servant232

PROVIDED HIM WITH A DECENT RESULTS, why in the hell would you enforce evidence-based training on him?

Technically, you can get 80% of the results with 20% of the effort. Effort meaning both physically via training & how you train strategically. So you can still look good even if you are training suboptimally.

Stick to a diet of whole foods, lift 2-3 times a week doing literally anything and you’ll be able to get pretty lean and pretty strong, relative to the general population.

However, If you want to be great at anything, i.e, competitive, that other 80% becomes crucial. The first 20% you invested got you 80% of the results. The last 20% may get you 2%. But, in elite competition, 2% is a big deal.

What people are getting hung up on is that they are missing the line between being able to look decent with suboptimal training vs being able to compete well.

We have many evidence-based, flexible guidelines and recommendations by the best physique coaches that will help someone achieve that 2%. It's why they do it.

 

[servant232]

@great_depression Have I missed somehwere OP asking about advice how to win his regionals?

Have I missed somewhere OP asking what is wrong with his style of training, what should he change and improve, tips and tricks?

Or this is just jehovas witness entering without knocking

 

[great_depression]

@servant232 The subreddit name doesn't mean drug-free fitness, it means drug-free bodybuildng, as in competition. Since competition is where that 2% matters, that's why you are seeing fellow competitors trying to help.

Personally, I do not care how the OP trains. I am just clearing up some things about what is being recommended to him and why. I have not given him advice.

 

[servant232]

@great_depression Then you are just spamming. My original comment was referring to this Auriel guy that tried enforce evidence based stuff on the guy that never even asked for it. Just like Jehova

If somebody doesnt care, why would you?

If OP created a thread in which asks in well manner: ok guys, I have problems placing well on my shows. This is my current style of training. How do I improve?" Then I can very well see the scenario of suggesting him those sources.

But in this manner is just absurde! Its like forcing him scientific article down his throat. What does that achieve? This is the source of where the scepticism about evidence based communty starts. This example, this comment section.

 

[niecey85]

@servant232 "What works for you" implies you've tried everything and accurately selected the best option, nothing wrong with that, but this doesn't sound like the case. Also, while interpersonal variability exists, it's not without restriction, it's always around the averages that comes out from the studies, that's why the practical applications from an evidence based practice is not "research shows this so do this" but rather "research shows this so start here". Also, we're not discussing a single study here, but the whole body of literature to date, including multiple meta-analysis. So I assume you didn't read the references I showed, I recommend you do, it's super valuable information.

Finally, as I said the other user, we're talking about a competitor, not a general fitness enthusiast. While you can get 80% of the gains just showing up to the gym, we're the ones who must go for that final 20% or lose. I guess my tone could be mistaken as condescending, but that wasn't my intention. It's just that there's so much bullshit information surrounding lifting, and on the other hand research has been showing a more or less unifying trend for such a long time now, that I feel really bummed when I see a competitor training so far away from the recommended guidelines just because they just weren't in the right circumstances for the information to reach them, because it's a real waste for them and for the sport in general.

 

[servant232]

@niecey85 "What works for you" implies you've tried everything and accurately selected the best option, nothing wrong with that, but this doesn't sound like the case."

No, it doesnt. "What works for you" implies that you find a method that is capable of producing individually satisfying results. It doesnt mean selecting the best option and the most optimal one. And you will never find the optimal one.

" but rather "research shows this so start here" "

There is no need to start anything since OP doesnt want to end anything. If he wanted, he would ask. You know, a simple question.

" that I feel really bummed when I see a competitor training so far away from the recommended guidelines "

And I feel bummed when people create mockery of subreddits like this one in which they shove "generel guidelines" down to the peoples throat in the name of optimal progress.

I am gonna repeat myself. OP never asked, never showed intention of changing anything niether asked opinion about his routine. He never asked for advices on how to place better on his competitions. All he has done is he posted his macros and routine.

He got attacked for both which is incredibly absurde and on the mention of this routine he got showered with 35 articles and "sorry to bear you a bad news, your training is shit. and even though you didnt ask for it, i am gonna still give you a evidence based links just to prove my point".

THis whole thread is just absurde. One big absurde and mockery of rational thought.

 

[dawn16]

@servant232 @great_depression has a thread explaining what guidelines are. I think you should read it because you seem to have some parts right but not fully and it's creating a lot of issues. you are confusing evidence-based with science-based

https://www.reddit.com/r/naturalbodybuilding/comments/ftmo9g/hypertrophy_training_its_not_that_complicated

 

[servant232]

@dawn16 Ok, this is just hilarious, I am not gonna respond same sentence 15 times in a row.

 

[mariemarie89]

@niecey85 Mmmm yes a heated debate I see coming

 

[smash89]

@niecey85 I gained 45lbs of lean mass over 4 years so I’m pretty sure training like a regular bodybuilder works just fine.

I basically try to train and eat like someone on gear and it’s been great.