Frustrated with barbell back squats

[ortho]

Just wanting to get some advice here because I don’t understand why I’m struggling so much with this. Barbell back squats. Been doing them for 2+ years now, and within that time period I’ve had a coach help me with form for about 2 months and in that time I’ve managed to go up to about 80kg x 8 reps in one set. But since I started practising them myself I always could not get much heavier than that, at least not for long. I think when I was on a mass gain phase I managed to do 95kg x 5 reps, but my form isn’t great all the time and I really struggle to hit depth (past parallel).

Other than that if I go on vacation or get sick I always regress on my squat and have to spend time getting it back and it’s so frustrating. Aside from that the thought of having to do squats always make me anxious because I never am sure if I can replicate my performance from last training time and I end up filled with dread when I have the bar on my back and feel how heavy it is. This is worse when I’m on weight loss periods and could definitely feel myself getting weaker.
Meanwhile I see people online being able to squat ass to grass like no problem and with impressive weights and it just makes me feel worse about myself.

All this is making me really hate squats and I don’t look forward to any gym sessions with them. But I don’t want to get rid of them completely because they’re such a useful exercise. How can I resolve this and learn to love squats again?

Thanks so much

Edit: I should mention that at the moment I’m squatting at 75kg x 5 right now (I’ve just recovered from an illness that put me out of the gym for 2 weeks and surprise surprise my squat has regressed again) and I’m trying to build it back up once again. I’m just sick of spinning my wheels and never being able to hit my PR for a long time. Also I’m 28years old if that’s relevant at all.

 

[winning]

@ortho Have you worked with powerlifting coach? This can be a great way to fine tune bar path etc. Check out Juggernaut training systems pillars series on YouTube

or the book starting strength by Mark Rippetoe for technical help as well.

Linear programming can work if used well. Ex: train strength for 4-6 weeks at a rep range with deloads, do hypertrophy and peak blocks mixed in. DUP plans are great for advanced lifters moving a lot of weight that is highly fatiguing. The trick is, if you break out a DUP now, you won’t have it as a brand new tool next time you plateau under heavier weights. Form first, play with that later. But still make sure to get some hypertrophy and strength blocks in, change up your rep ranges block to block.

Wondering what your speed is like? I have some clients who just need a mix of getting more hip/ankle ROM and then we either up their speed into the hole or stay a little more controlled and their weights go up like crazy. I agree with prioritizing depth, not ATG but parallel or comp depth if you ever are interested in competing.

 

[karmel]

@ortho Do you have good ankle mobility? Barbell back squats have always been my strength in terms of form and performance, and I think having really good ankle mobility might play a part? Before i squat, for years, i've always done standing calf wall stretches before my sets and i think it helps with being able to squat deeply with ease (i know stretching isnt technically recommended before but it's my personal must). Idk if this would help but maybe see how well and long you can hold a third world squat. If u can't do it or do it for long maybe you need more ankle mobility OR it's a matter of genetics idk enough about the technical stuff

Edit: i know it's technically a calf stretch but it really helps stretch the back area near your ankle and when i do it, i very gently push in order to stretch and Idk, all my advice is anecdotal from someone who is good at squats so take it all with a grain of salt. It's the one where you put your foot up against the wall, some of the ones on google dont show the exact one so i thought id describe

 

[karmel]

I also probably have somewhat 'megan thee stallion knees', if you ever feel kind of crackly or stiff in the knees even a little bit, it will make squatting heavy feel really nerving and uncomfortable. Hip mobility is also important but I think ive always had natural mobility so i cant comment on any thing that could be of value

 

[brokenjohninchrist]

@ortho maybe unpopular opinion but if you dont enjoy an exercise, you do not have to do it (unless they're integral to reaching your goal ex. in powerlifting competitions)

ive switched barbell back squats for lunges, split squats, leg press and have been enjoying my workouts and seeing more progress than ever before. there are ALWAYS alternatives that work the same muscles.

 

[dawn16]

@brokenjohninchrist I agree!
I did them for a while, met some goals. Hurt my back really bad.. have done them a few times since but I kinda don’t really see the appeal of balancing a hundred something pounds on the top of my spine.. it doesn’t even sound beneficial. I have sciatica pretty bad and it gets irritated every time. Besides, when am I ever gonna need to carry that much weight on my back in regular life ?

 

[rgvbaptist]

@ortho I relate hard to literally everything in this post lol. Here are a couple things a trainer recently suggested to me:

• try doing a slow drop to correct depth (6 seconds) at 60-65% of your 1RM, then pop up as usual. This will help you identify if you’re compensating in any part of the lift by shifting weight or relying on one side, and can also help break the movement path that’s already ingrained that may be imbalanced but subconscious due to the speed of the movement. She suggested 6x5 like this.
• try dropping to depth as quickly as is comfortable, pause for three seconds, then pop up as usual at 60-65% of your 1RM. This helps build strength at the bottom of the squat that will help with stability at depth as you increase weight. She suggested 6x5 for this type too (on a separate leg day).
• you can also use a belted squat machine to add small weight increments without the fear of failing the squat and having to bail a bar.
• sometimes weak hip flexors are to blame for weakness at the bottom of the squat. Between sets, she suggested I use a low-resistance hip-width resistance band around the arches of my feet. While lying on the floor with your feet up on a bench, you bridge up your back like a glute bridge so just your shoulders are making contact. Then you “march” by raising one foot at a time so the hip is at 90° to the body, the knee at 90°, and the foot at 90° to the ankle with the resistance band over the top of the foot. The leg shouldn’t cross the midline, it should stay in its vertical plane.

Hope some of these suggestions might help!

 

[crazythat]

@ortho I don’t have issues with my physical build when it comes to squats so my feedback might not be helpful. That said, confidence really matters. I was stuck at a 102kg 1RM squat for a significant amount of time because I had several experiences where I really struggled or failed lower weights. I let those get to me and my squat stopped increasing. Finding ways to hype myself up and increase my confidence helped me break through that mental barrier and I literally shot from 102kg to a very easy 115kg in one day. So, sometimes mental can prevent you from reaching your full potential especially on squats.

 

[anon103]

@ortho Couple things I'm seeing here:

• You've had to take breaks (vacation, illness). Makes sense that that would interrupt progress.
• You feel like you're weaker in a cut. This really shouldn't be the case, unless your nutrition is seriously lacking or you're doing a huge deficit. Either you need to adjust some things nutrition wise, or it's not actually as much of a problem as it may seem, because of...
• Confidence issues (including feeling how heavy the bar is on your back). That's not a squat problem specifically, although feeling successful in squats can help. We build confidence by accumulating wins.
• You're not sure if you can replicate performance from previous training. Are you trying to add weight to the bar every time? That could be your main, fixable problem.

Adding weight to the bar every workout is what you do in a beginner on-ramp kind of program. For continued gains, you don't need to do that, and it's not necessarily productive to do that. (It tends to lead to fatigue, for obvious reasons, and confidence issues--which might sound familiar!) I know that you feel like you're not as strong as you used to be, but you don't "earn" graduation from a beginner program by hitting a certain weight or confidence level. You should ditch it as soon as it's not serving you. Trying to "milk" one of those programs for two years is just running yourself into the same wall over and over.

I suggest finding a program that (1) is not an LP (ie doesn't make you add weight to the bar every workout) and that (2) has an amount of intensity and volume that have worked for many other people. Most of the "intermediate" programs in the wiki here fit the bill.

With submaximal weights, you may feel at first like you're not doing enough, but that dread should start to dissipate because you'll be finishing sets feeling strong and capable. A good program will take advantage of the lowered fatigue and higher confidence, often by giving you more total volume (more sets per week) and more variety in rep ranges, and perhaps more accessories as well. All of these things broaden your base; you'll be teaching your body to get good at a wider range of things, setting yourself up for more robust gains as you move forward.

TL;DR get a new, better program instead of repeating the stuff that hasn't been working.

 

[pamcaid]

@ortho What role do back squats have in your exercise routine?

If you're focused on hypertrophy (muscle growth), there are plenty of other exercises that can get you that.

I would take a break from back squats. Sounds like they're stale for you and you're really frustrated with them. Perhaps a break would be good mentally and then you can come back later and maybe they'll feel fresh and you'll be excited to do them.

Other exercises you could try, if you haven't already: front squats, hack squat, pendulum squat, leg press, zercher squats, walking lunges, Bulgarian split squats.

 

[markmirza]

@ortho Going past parallel isn't for everyone's anatomy. I could theoretically do it but because I'm hypermobile it actually puts me at a very high risk for disc probs in my back, which I'm still recovering from.

If going past parallel is difficult, try sticking to parallel for a bit and see how that feels.

 

[forgivenkali]

@markmirza I'll say it: ATG is overrated.

 

[jimz]

@markmirza Do you mind sharing more about this? I am also hypermobile, and have recurring nerve pain due to a herniated disc in my back. I spent some time with a PT who encouraged me only to go as low as comfortable, but the problem is that it basically feels comfortable until it doesn't one time and then I'm out of commission for months.

 

[markmirza]

@jimz It really depends on your own anatomy of course, and level of hypermobility. Maybe be more conservative with depth but also start without much weight - lower than you usually would - to really nail down form again without fear (because imo fear is also a massive part after injury).

I'd check your squats in a mirror too to see if your lower back flexes in or out at lower limits or if it stays neutral. Imo sometimes as hypermobile people we need to be extra careful about flexion since our spines can be too bendy and put the force into our joints. I can keep mine straight past parallel but not consistently, so I avoid it on heavy. Make sure you do very intense stabilization exercises in general because I've learned from various PTs with hypermobility we often rely on our big muscles in place of our stabilizers, it's a constant battle to figure out how to engage the small stabilizers in the trunk. Def work on isometrics too to help proprioception.

Maybe it is easier to find your limit with less weight first. I do deep squats without weight or without much weight just to work that ROM in a way that feels safe and to strengthen the stabilizing muscles and try and keep back from flexing weirdly. Sometimes it doesn't work, but when that's the case at least I am not loading with tons of weight that could lead to a very serious reinjury.

Such is the nature of hypermobility anyway, injuries are just more common and we have to work at it for life. Also like you said it's always fine til it isn't. I find injuries take a long time to start showing but it helps to get almost a hyper awareness of your muscles and know your limits way earlier than most non hypermobile people would. Proprioception work is your friend, like balancing exercises. I use a half bosu for a lot for work, lighter squats, single leg stuff, etc. it helps!

I hope your PT was helpful in that regard, but if not, I also recommend finding a physio specialized in hypermobility! Makes a world of difference

 

[jimz]

@markmirza Thank you so much for this thoughtful answer! The hypermobility can be dangerously misleading - I have no issues going and holding deep in my squat in without weight because I am hypermobile, but I do feel exactly what you said in terms adding weight and putting force into my joints. AND the fear - I start getting nervous and losing confidence around 50% of my max now.

My PT gave me a lot of core stabilizing exercises to do, and a lot more unilateral work than I ever did before. I think I will look into more proprioception work that I can incorporate as well!

 

[angelod]

@markmirza Fellow hyper mobility struggler here. I have to think so hard about correct form so as to not hurt myself sometimes.

 

[markmirza]

@angelod Right? It is a struggle. I enjoy weightlifting because I actually gain a ton of proprioception from it as well as bigger muscles help in limiting my extra mobility beneficially, but that definitely did not used to be the case before lots of guidance.

 

[sunshine27]

@ortho I have had issues with being good with form at lower weights but when closer to my max I would have anxiety about getting out of the hole. You’re only as strong as the weakest part of your range of motion so if you’re weak at the bottom, you’ve got to get stronger there before adding more weight. Might be pause squats or box squats, all at weights that feel lower than they should. Might be single leg squats and hip/glute work to ensure that you have confidence in your stability at the bottom.

Do you wear lifting shoes? Might also help (i would argue more so than a belt, which is useful but only above 70%—lower than that you should be training your brace).

The other significant piece is eating and resting to grow strength.

 

[thetravman]

@sunshine27 1+1 1/4 squats are also good at building strength out of the whole. You descend, come a bit back up, go back down and then ascend as fully to complete the lift.

Also, if lifting shoes aren't an option, heel lifts have worked well for me. I have the older version of the VersaLifts and my understanding is some stules of Metcon come with one too.

 

[graceadele]

@ortho My anatomy (long femurs) + ankle injury from childhood makes back squats so hard to progress for me. For most people their squat is similar to their DL. My DL is almost twice my squat. I also tried everything and got so frustrated. No advice, just sympathy. I still do them once a week but I've been focusing more on lunges and bulgarian split squats because I can progress on those.